Discussion of UPS equipment for server and network equipment rack

[timeshifter]

Can we talk about UPSs? I've used and recommended them for my clients for several decades. Typically a single UPS to run a server or workstation or maybe a modem and switch or whatever. Most sophisticated I've used are the SmartUPS 1500 towers that sell for around $300-$400 new.

One of my larger businesses has a big 4 post rack setup. Lots of equipment. He wants a good UPS and is OK spending $2,000 or more. Here's a list of what's in that rack (or next to it)

Device name - wattage
EdgeSwitch 24 250W 40
Netgear ProSAFE GS748t 40
UniFi XG 36
UniFi USG Pro 4 40
5 port PoE switch 10
Phone system NEC SL2100 172
HP 1920-16G JG932A 13
EdgeSwitch 24 250W 40
Samsung DVR 60
Dell monitor 20
Lenovo TS440 200
Cable modem 10

Total of about 680 watts, but one of the EdgeSwitchs is all cameras so maybe more like 880 watts total

I've made a few phone calls to APC's sales support and gotten a recommendation or two, but I'm still not feeling confident about my selections. They suggested two options.

Option 1
SMX1500RM2UCNC $1850
SMX48RMBP2U $779

Option 2
SMX1000C $899
SMX48RMBP2U $779
NMC add on if desired, AP9641 with environment monitoring $659 or AP9640 $419.

Customer is on board with Option 1. As I was getting links ready to send him to order from I noticed that there are not a lot of plugs on the unit. So I may need a PDU of some sort.

Also, I've seen new UPSs just fail hard. Maybe it'd be better to have several UPSs instead of one monster one with lots of batteries.

Do I really need or care about a network card? They all have a cloud connected monitor, that is monitor only. Might be sufficient.

Final, big question: what about lithium-ion based UPSs? Like that they're not so damned heavy. Like that the batteries are claimed to last 8-10 years instead of 3-5.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

Kinda odd mixture of switches there....if I have Unifi APs...I'll have Unifi switches. You have 3x maybe 4x different brands there!

Anyways, I like to leave "room for growth" with UPS's.....so just quick skimming that list I came up with the rack mount 1500 if not 2200.
I also have seen over the decades....UPS's that were well above needed capacity tend to live longer and more problem free lives. Versus...USP's that have their capacity met or pushed....since they will work much harder, strain their batteries more. Don't forget UPS's work all the time, not just during power outages...they work pretty much daily during little brown outs (dips in power) that you don't even notice.

I haven't done Lion batteries yet. Haven't done a new server rack build in a while, as I'm actually on a pretty steady course lately of getting rid of server racks at clients (moving to all cloud).

 

[HCHTech]

Some (most?) of APC's fancier UPSs with NICs now report to their cloud interface which lets you setup event notifications that way. The SMT2200 tower I purchased recently for a client has this option. It's an easier setup than the "old" way. To my surprise, they don't charge extra for this service - although it wouldn't surprise me if they changed their mind on that as time goes on.

 

[Markverhyden]

I consider having a PDU to be critical. To begin with the UPS are mounted at the bottom of the rack and most have their outlets in the back. Making it a pain to get to. Next there's the nearly inevitable mess of excess cable run (length) that accumulates in the bottom. The PDU's that I like the best are vertical mounted, just like how the equipment is distributed in the rack. And for a 4 post rack my preference is definitely for a rack mount UPS.

Li-ion vs SLA? Can't say I've ever heard of a SLA spontaneously combusting. Li-ion? Different story. To get an idea of how bad it can get read up about the Felicity Ace. Also pretty much every single outfit that I've seen/been inside, including Apple back of house repair, has a container of sand handy for those pesky little moments.

SLA's can and do last a long time. Got one company I do work with that has small UPS's in grocery store coupon kiosks. On average I'd say I'm replacing the battery or UPS when their 6-7 years old. The key to SLA is regular testing.

Link below to the APC load calculator if you haven't already gone there.

UPS Selector

 

[timeshifter]

Some (most?) of APC's fancier UPSs with NICs now report to their cloud interface which lets you setup event notifications that way. The SMT2200 tower I purchased recently for a client has this option. It's an easier setup than the "old" way. To my surprise, they don't charge extra for this service - although it wouldn't surprise me if they changed their mind on that as time goes on.

This is true - and confusing. By default they all have a "serial" connection and a network connection. The "serial" one connects to a USB port on a computer using that weird cable that is USB A to RJ45. Same as all the low end units too.

These mid range units all have a green network port that connects to their free cloud monitoring service. It's limited as I understand, kinda read only. So there's not much concern about security with your power components being controllable from the could.

Then you can get two kinds of NMC - network management card. One has environmental monitoring which is temperature basically, I think. The other doesn't. Both connect to your LAN and have a web interface. Not sure we'll need those.

Anyway, that's my current understanding, may not be 100% accurate, use at your own risk

The PDU's that I like the best are vertical mounted, just like how the equipment is distributed in the rack.

Any recommendation on PDUs?

Your concern about fires is valid. I hope that I never regret the recommendation. If I think about my experience and my world (not just what I've seen on the news) I'm not directly familiar with any lithium-ion combustion events, and there is no shortage of lithium-ion powered devices in my world.

On the flip side I've seen several failures where the lead acid batteries went toes up. Also dealt with (almost) not being able to remove a swollen battery.

 

[Markverhyden]

Any recommendation on PDUs?

Your concern about fires is valid. I hope that I never regret the recommendation. If I think about my experience and my world (not just what I've seen on the news) I'm not directly familiar with any lithium-ion combustion events, and there is no shortage of lithium-ion powered devices in my world.

On the flip side I've seen several failures where the lead acid batteries went toes up. Also dealt with (almost) not being able to remove a swollen battery.

PDU's? Two choices. The low cost route is just get a long power strip from somewhere like Home Deport, Lowes, etc

https://www.lowes.com/pd/ProHT-12-Outlet-Aluminum-Power-Strip-with-3-Ft-Power-Cord/1002814444

Or go for the real thing at at least 10x price.

Rack PDU, Basic, Zero U, 20A, 120V, (24)5-20 - AP7530 | APC USA

AP7530 - Rack PDU, Basic, Zero U, 20A, 120V, (24)5-20 | APC USA

www.apc.com

I've never had a SLA UPS where the battery leaked, exploded etc. Yes some did swell a bit so swapping out was a pain. The way I look at it the ecosystem for a rack UPS doesn't justify the risk of Li-ion batteries. Now, say if you did campus sized heat maps I could easily see using a Li-ion UPSs for powering the AP's. Much lighter than SLA and if one happens to have a problem the most you might loose is a laptop and AP. Personally I've only ever had one issue with a Li-ion battery in a smart device, battery swelled causing the case to split. But that doesn't mean I think they are ideal for a rack UPS solution. Or any stationary unattended solution.

 

[Sky-Knight]

Some (most?) of APC's fancier UPSs with NICs now report to their cloud interface which lets you setup event notifications that way. The SMT2200 tower I purchased recently for a client has this option. It's an easier setup than the "old" way. To my surprise, they don't charge extra for this service - although it wouldn't surprise me if they changed their mind on that as time goes on.

I doubt they will because that's the loss leader. The purpose of that system is to get someone enrolled to receive sales notifications for batteries and warranties.

As for battery chemistry, I've had lead acid catch fire just as often as lithium. The latter lasts longer, so I'll take it.

 

[timeshifter]

Here's what APC has to say about the safety of it

https://blog.apc.com/2018/02/07/safety-li-ion-batteries-ups/

I was thinking of one of these for a power strip, have one on a workbench at home

https://blog.apc.com/2018/02/07/safety-li-ion-batteries-ups/

Not sure how to mount it to look nice and functional. Might look for something less than $400 but more than $20.

 

[Sky-Knight]

@timeshifter I do not believe that lion batteries are any more dangerous than lead acid. But I live in a hot place, and lead acid gets me 2 years at best.

LiONs are so far looking like they'll hit the 10 year mark. But the amount of money APC wants for them is the only sticking point. They should cost more than the lead acid unit sure, but they've got them priced at 80% of the value of a lead acid unit + replacement batteries every two years. The resulting cost is quite absurd.

 

[SAFCasper]

When you say "a good UPS" what's the basis for this? As in what is the client looking for.

If it's good build quality, reliability and a relatively long runtime I don't see any problem with your Option 1.

Having several UPS sounds nice in theory but IMO not really a benefit in this situation. None of your equipment has redundant power supply except maybe the TS440. No matter how many UPS you have there is always going to be loss of service if one fails. I'd just make sure to have a backup plan if the worst does happen (eg. an adaptor to plug your PDU's directly into mains temporarily).

If the problem your client has is a "dirty" mains power supply with frequent spikes/dips in voltage, brownouts etc then you want to avoid line-interactive power conversion. Your devices are still running off mains power when it's available and only switch to battery when power is lost. The power gets filtered in-line to make it a bit cleaner, but it's not perfect. Plus there is a small delay when switching over to battery which some more sensitive equipment does not like.

Costs a bit more but models with Online Double Conversion handle this much better. They convert mains AC power to DC stored in the battery then back to AC again to supply your devices. This means power is always being supplied from the battery which allows a constant and stable supply. There is zero switchover delay when power is lost because there is no switchover to make - it was already running from battery.

Example would be SRT2200RMXLI + SRT72RMBP
Chose that example because we have 2 of them

 

[Markverhyden]

Here's what APC has to say about the safety of it

https://blog.apc.com/2018/02/07/safety-li-ion-batteries-ups/

I was thinking of one of these for a power strip, have one on a workbench at home

https://blog.apc.com/2018/02/07/safety-li-ion-batteries-ups/

Not sure how to mount it to look nice and functional. Might look for something less than $400 but more than $20.

The links are the same.

 

[timeshifter]

Oops. Was supposed to be a harbor freight link, in car now will update later.

 

[Markverhyden]

Oops. Was supposed to be a harbor freight link, in car now will update later.

No worries. I'm always interested what others use for different items.

 

[timeshifter]

Here's the correct link

12-Outlet, 4 ft. Metal Power Strip

Amazing deals on this 12 Outlet 4Ft Metal Power Strip at Harbor Freight. Quality tools & low prices.

www.harborfreight.com

 

[jzukerman]

Eaton is the brand that I've been working with for close to 10 years now. Have some units out there with 5 yr old SLA batteries. I stopped using APC SLA UPS units as they overcharge batteries and many units don't have internal fans, leading to premature death. I feel like they purposely designed their units this way to sell more batteries. I haven't looked at LIon systems yet. Waiting to see some results from long term use before recommending them. I do like that they are usually smaller and lighter than similarly sized SLA systems.