EVERYONE Needs to Close or Do Drop-Off Only - NOW!

[sapphirescales]

I haven't been here for quite some time because I've been preparing my own business for this crisis. Whatever measures you're taking to "sanitize" your work area or implement "social distancing" is NOT enough! Why? Because the cleaning solutions available SUCK and take many MINUTES of constant contact with the surfaces being 100% SATURATED with the cleaner to actually do the job.

For example, Clorox bleach requires at least 5 FULL MINUTES of leaving the surface SOPPING WET in order to kill viruses! Even hospital grade disinfectant takes 1-2 minutes. How do you keep a laptop keyboard sopping wet for minutes at a time without ruining it? YOU CAN'T!

Simply spraying the surface and wiping it up right away does NOTHING! It might kill 1% of the viruses. Soap is the best way by far to get rid of the Coronavirus, but you still need to scrub vigorously for 20 seconds to get rid of the virus! I don't think you'll be taking a laptop in the shower with you, so this is not an option for cleaning laptops.

The Coronavirus can survive on plastic for 3-17 days (there's no real consensus here). It can spread through droplets from an infected person coughing. These linger in the air for several hours before falling to the floor. If someone coughs in their hand and then touches something and you touch it, BOOM - you've got the virus on you! If you touch your face you're infected.

So what have I done to protect myself and my employees from the Coronavirus? I've instituted a strict drop-off/pickup policy. There is NO contact between my clients and myself or my employees. ALL of my employees (including myself) are working from home. The shop is closed. I've helped every employee convert their garage into a special work area where they can keep potentially contaminated computers away from their homes and families. When a client wants to have their computer worked on, they're directed to the closest employee's house. Each employee has an outdoor drop-off table so there's no contact between clients and employees. We all wear gloves at ALL times. Each computer is worked on individually and the work table is sanitized between each computer with hospital grade disinfectant that kills Coronavirus within 2 minutes.

I'm 100% self isolating now and will have ZERO contact with anyone outside my household. I even open packages in my garage and put the contents into marked bags for THREE WEEKS before bringing them into my house.

I don't trust anything the government says about this virus and neither should you. From the beginning, the government has tried to downplay this virus. They've lied and done everything possible to keep the money flowing at the cost of thousands of lives. Now Trump wants to end the quarantine? No thanks. I don't care if everyone else in the world goes back to "business as usual." I have older family members with pre-existing medical conditions and I will not risk their lives (or anyone else's lives) over money. Money isn't worth sh*t if you're dead or without the people you care about.

"Social distancing" and Lysol aren't going to prevent you from getting or spreading this virus. They're just feel-good measures that don't do jack. Literally the only thing we can do is avoid person-to-person contact and either sanitize or quarantine new items coming into our homes for at least 3 weeks. Yes, there are people that are vital to society that can't work from home (utility workers, truck drivers, people involved in food, etc.), but if we limit the spread to a small segment of the population we can at least control how many people need to be hospitalized at any given time.

I was really hoping this would never happen during my lifetime, but here we are. I can only hope that this will lead to an amazing medical breakthrough regarding viruses similar to what happened with bacteria and antibiotics, but that could take years. In the meantime I'm doing everything I can to limit the spread and continue providing service to my clients and jobs to my employees.

Even this hospital-grade disinfectant requires THREE MINUTES of leaving the surface SOPPING WET in order to kill Coronavirus. Here's the PDF directly from the company:

https://embed.widencdn.net/download/kavokerr/tvf37wbhp3/MKT-19-0205_CC_Wallchart_US_V2.pdf?u=iywczu

Yeah, you can't do that with a laptop keyboard. WEAR GLOVES! Of course, wearing gloves won't do sh*t for you if you're still seeing clients. One cough and you're infected. You need to work from home. If you work in the shop and an employee gets it from breaking quarantine, you're all infected. Up to 30% of spreaders are asymptomatic! This means they don't feel sick yet they're spreading the virus!

Never in the history of the world has there been mass quarantines like this. There's a reason governments are doing this. This is NOT the flu. This sh*t is worse than most people realize right now, but they'll come to know the true horror of this in the coming weeks. Exponential growth is a concept most people don't truly understand. We're in the beginning stages. I just hope we can avoid exponential growth.

 

[Metanis]

"Social distancing" and Lysol aren't going to prevent you from getting or spreading this virus. They're just feel-good measures that don't do jack.

I don't really disagree with most of what you said or are doing. However I think you misunderstand the government's goal. It's not to prevent people from getting it, the goal is to simply slow the rate of infection so the health care system doesn't get overwhelmed. And that's only so the mortality rate doesn't explode due to lack of hospital and staff.

The government's role also includes trying to ensure we have an economy when we get through this thing. As a species we can survive a really high mortality rate, but as a country and an economy we need to be able to get back to business as usual later this year. That means keeping the mortality rate down around 3 or 4%. It's sad but that's the nature of the beast.

 

[britechguy]

Nothing like a reasoned response.

Let's drop the irrational panic.

 

[britechguy]

Also, let's drop the factual inaccuracies, which are far too numerous to mention, and which a few minutes of web research on surface disinfection methods that have been in use for decades proves beyond a shadow of a doubt. Sopping wet and soaking just isn't done on a routine basis, in fact it's incredibly rare. Viruses are delicate creatures when on surfaces that cannot act as hosts (which is any hard, impermeable, non-organic surface) and the slightest bit of disinfectant knocks them out pronto on those surfaces.

 

[kwest]

I don't really disagree with most of what you said or are doing. However I think you misunderstand the government's goal. It's not to prevent people from getting it, the goal is to simply slow the rate of infection so the health care system doesn't get overwhelmed. And that's only so the mortality rate doesn't explode due to lack of hospital and staff.

The government's role also includes trying to ensure we have an economy when we get through this thing. As a species we can survive a really high mortality rate, but as a country and an economy we need to be able to get back to business as usual later this year. That means keeping the mortality rate down around 3 or 4%. It's sad but that's the nature of the beast.

Exactly. The fact is most of us will get it and the people with compromised immune systems are in danger. Everyone else will get through it and then be immune to the virus. Government is not trying to stop it just slow it down so people that need it get treatment.

 

[sapphirescales]

Also, let's drop the factual inaccuracies, which are far too numerous to mention, and which a few minutes of web research on surface disinfection methods that have been in use for decades proves beyond a shadow of a doubt. Sopping wet and soaking just isn't done on a routine basis, in fact it's incredibly rare. Viruses are delicate creatures when on surfaces that cannot act as hosts (which is any hard, impermeable, non-organic surface) and the slightest bit of disinfectant knocks them out pronto on those surfaces.

Read the PDF from the actual website. The reason why people are less sick than they used to be is because people wash their hands, not because these chemical disinfectants are actually effective. EVERYTHING I said was true, the most terrifying of which is how long surfaces have to remain wet in order for the disinfectant to actually work.

Exactly. The fact is most of us will get it and the people with compromised immune systems are in danger. Everyone else will get through it and then be immune to the virus. Government is not trying to stop it just slow it down so people that need it get treatment.

And what do you think I'm trying to do here? There are far too many dumba$$es out there that aren't taking this seriously. They will infect many others and overwhelm the hospitals. The people that do take it seriously need to take it VERY seriously to reduce the possibility of infection to practically zero, because there will be a lot of people that don't do sh*t and don't care.

In a couple of weeks there will likely be a million infected here in the US if we continue on this course. Then the mortality rate will reach double digits. By taking extreme measures NOW, you could potentially save hundreds of thousands of lives.

If people actually do what I suggest though, the virus will flatten out and it will look like a big dud. This will give people a false sense of security, restrictions will ease, and it will spike again. They say it will take 18 months to create a vaccine. Well, even without a vaccine it would require everyone in the US getting sick over an 18 month period to avoid overwhelming the medical system.

 

[britechguy]

It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into.
~ Jonathan Swift (1667 - 1745), Irish essayist, novelist, & satirist

 

[sapphirescales]

It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into.
~ Jonathan Swift (1667 - 1745), Irish essayist, novelist, & satirist

I'll see you in a few weeks, smarta$$. People like you will have to bear the guilt of causing thousands of needless deaths. I don't envy you.

 

[River Valley Computer]

I knew it wouldn't be too long before these two would confront each other. Just sayin'

 

[coffee]

While I agree with the fact that we do need to take precautions for the sake of older or people in already poor help I do want to add my thoughts on this.

The most important thing is to not go off the chain emotionally with this. There are a lot of people freaking out and hoarding food, Calling others evil because they are not putting themselves into isolation from world - whatever.

Here are my talking points:

The Chinese virus is just another type of flu. Its main attribute that makes it kinda special is its infection rate. Those that are old or compromised health-wise should be worried to the extent that they should take particular precautions.

Going from the CDC statistics, The common flu kills (on average) 1800 Americans each month.

No matter what precautions you take, This flu has to run its course like so many in the past. The main weapon against the flu is warm weather. Like your milk in the refrigerator, The virus does not survive in warm weather. Therefore, By the time the warm weather hits its stride the virus will tend to die off. This is exactly the same with the common flu. That is why we call fall/winter the "flu Season" and all the cold commercials start running on TV. So, We are trying to limit the threat of exposure as others have said to limit the hit on Hospitals and also get into the warm weather.

It is particular to note that no other president has done so much during a declared flu epidemic since the great flu outbreak in the early 1900's. In my 59 years of living on the earth I cannot remember a time that the government has acted so quickly with such measures concerning a flu outbreak. I commend out president for the steps he has been taking. Everyone should.

What I do find appalling about this whole matter is the way the media has hyped this up into a frenzy of fear. My Brother had the opportunity to chat with a very respected infectious disease doctor in his area. The doctor said to my Brother "Do you know the first steps you should take when a pandemic is declared? - Turn off your TV and throw out your newspapers".

In the past we have had a lot of virus attacks - SARS, H1N1, The Hong Kong Flu, ect... They all run their course and have been forgotten. The only difference this time is that the Chinese Flu is just spreads faster. It has the same symptoms of the common flu. Those that are compromised health wise often do develop complications such as pneumonia and must be hospitalized. That is why we should take these steps to slow the infection rate down so we can get a handle on this.

So, Above else, Turn off the TV. Just go and visit the CDC website for your latest news.

Currently I am doing remote support and visiting my business clients sites only when there is a server problem. They are closed and no one there anyways.

Ok, Stay calm everyone. Today its suppose to hit 60F in my area. So, I might go out and work on the car. I should probably clean out the shop from a winters worth of mess.

 

[Sky-Knight]

Yeah everyone in the US comparing this monster to the Flu is just showing their rampant ignorance and talking out their collective posteriors.

Sars != Flu

This thing is vastly more contagious than the Flu is, and is actually comparatively less deadly. The problem is it has the power to infect so many people at a time, that tiny percentage of people that need medical assistance is overwhelming our medical system.

Here in AZ, the number of cases doubled again in the last 24 hours, these numbers are going to continue to skyrocket because Arizona FINALLY started rampant testing. But, if Wuhan is any indicator, for every confirmed case there are around 8 more unconfirmed cases. Each infected person will infect another 3 people before showing symptoms.

If you can't understand what a runaway train that represents, you need to do us all a favor and stop voting... and if I may be blunt while I'm at it suggest any such person stop working in IT, because such an individual obviously lacks the critical thinking skills required to make effective use of any form of modern technology. The false equivalence is forgivable given the fake news running around, but everything beyond that is inexcusable.

The other coronaviruses we've studied all hate the heat... so it's possible the Summer will slow this one down too. AZ will be a great case study on that, because it's going to get hot here over the next two months. If you see AZ's infection counts slowing... then yeah perhaps the Summer will bring us some reprieve. To those in the Southern Hemisphere... God be with you. For the moment however we do not have solid scientific evidence that SARS-CoV-2 is influenced by ambient temperature.

 

[Moltuae]

The main weapon against the flu is warm weather. Like your milk in the refrigerator, The virus does not survive in warm weather.

I don't understand what you're saying here. Are you comparing viruses to bacteria? ... Or milk?

Like most foodstuffs, milk spoils more quickly out of the refrigerator because bacteria thrive at warmer temperatures. However, bacteria and viruses are not the same.

 

[britechguy]

While bacteria and viruses are indeed not the same, viruses tend to thrive more in what we humans consider "cold weather" than in warm. It's not that they can't survive at all in warm weather, but just have a much harder time. One need only think of "flu season" and when it occurs annually in the northern hemisphere (and, I'd presume, conversely in the southern hemisphere) on an annual basis.

One of my biggest hopes is that as spring comes rapidly upon us that it will see a massive quelling, which is not to say complete eradication, of COVID-19. Only time will tell, but it's not unreasonable to expect it to behave like most other coronaviruses do, and they do exhibit "flu like" aspects other than in the symptoms they produce in humans.

 

[Sky-Knight]

Here's some words from a family friend that's also an ER Nurse at St. Jude in Phoenix.

Hey guys! News from the frontline for those who are interested. We are seeing sicker and sicker patients in my emergency room. This bug is no joke. Thank you all for doing your part to continue to practice social distancing. This helps slow it down so hospitals and ERs are not overwhelmed.

Things I have learned this past week...you should only be around people that live in your own home. At least in my ER, the sickest are those that are 50+, but this is not the case nation wide. I have seen several people that have caught this from extended family members without knowing...thinking it was still ok to see them. The virus progresses fast in those that need hospitalization.

If anyone wants more information or needs anything, let me know! My family is staying completely isolated since I am being exposed at my work, but I am happy to answer questions and love phone calls!!! Love and miss you all. We got this!

Because yeah... this is just another flu...

 

[britechguy]

Because yeah... this is just another flu...

And who, here, has made that claim?

Stating that there are very likely to be parallels in how this virus behaves as environmental conditions change, which is consistent with others of its class and influenza, is not saying anything at all about the severity of the symptoms.

It's also pretty clear that there are several demographics for whom COVID-19 is far more likely to cause severe issues than it does for most who catch it.

Saying that isn't making light of the issue, nor trying to dismiss or diminish it. It's a simple statement of fact.

I wish more of the media would be trying to guide us through the necessary precautions, explaining why those are necessary, rather than indulging in the "We're all gonna die!!," sensationalism that is running as rampant as the virus is. It's not helping anyone, and it makes a certain contingent more skeptical than they might otherwise be.

 

[Moltuae]

One of my biggest hopes is that as spring comes rapidly upon us that it will see a massive quelling

I hope so too but one potential flaw in the spring-quelling theory is that the virus has been taking hold in the southern hemisphere and a number of countries with warm climates.

 

[britechguy]

I hope so too but one potential flaw in the spring-quelling theory is that the virus has been taking hold in the southern hemisphere and a number of countries with warm climates.

Well, there's taking hold and there's TAKING HOLD. I am awaiting additional data regarding prevalence and incidence in different locations around the world. And we can't just go on incidence (as in an individual exhibited symptoms and, very likely, sought treatment and was confirmed infected) but need prevalence information (how many are actually infected in the population, regardless of how asymptomatic through critically ill they may have become).

On last night's news I was heartened to hear that in addition to diagnostic tests for those who are ill, there is an antibody test soon to come that can detect if you HAD COVID-19 and are all ready over it. We can't get a real handle on what we need to do over the longer term until we actually determine the prevalence of infection whether there was an incidence of illness from said infection or not.

 

[Sky-Knight]

@britechguy I'm willing to concede I'm on a hair trigger on this. With two at risk humans in this house, and my home state basically ignoring the threat... I'm getting real tired of people telling me it's just another cold/flu.

 

[britechguy]

@britechguy I'm willing to concede I'm on a hair trigger on this. With two at risk humans in this house, and my home state basically ignoring the threat... I'm getting real tired of people telling me it's just another cold/flu.

Which I can understand, entirely, if your state is not taking this seriously. Virginia is effectively entirely shut down except for essential businesses, which means you sell food (grocers or restaurants [take-out only]), are a pharmacy, bank, or sell fuel. And even most of our essential businesses, particularly banks, have closed all of their walk-in services and are working via drive-through only.

All I ask, though, is that no one, including myself, read anything beyond what someone else has written with regard to this illness. I certainly am not, in any way, minimizing it's communicability nor potential repercussions. I am complying with social distancing and staying at home. But we are, in reality, still lacking a lot of data necessary to figure out what works and what doesn't both in terms of treatments for COVID-19 and its actual prevalence versus incidence. And when I have compared to flu, it has never been in reference to symptoms or virulence, but in how viruses act as a class in response to things like sanitation measures and weather conditions.

My sincerest wishes that you and yours will remain entirely untouched by this scourge and that your state leaders will wake up to what needs to be done, at least until we know more.