PC's PSU ruining powerline ethernet

[MobileTechie]

I've spent many frustrating hours troubleshooting my own network problems which started when I started to use a new server. I thought it was down to DNS errors and so on but it turns out that the PSU inside PC is producing electrical noise which is messing with my Powerline/Homeplug ethernet connection.

Anyone seen this before? I'd really rather not have to rebuild the server and since the PSU came with the case that's what I'll have to do in order to get my money back on the case.

 

[TLE]

I wonder if a surge protecter designed for audio systems, that has a built in power filter would eradicate the noise such as this one from Belkin. http://www.kenable.co.uk/product_info.php?products_id=3603

 

[dipper]

Can you just replace the PSU?

Alternatiovely can you move the EOP kit away from the server?

 

[MobileTechie]

It's looks that way - just gonna have to bite the bullet and rebuild it. Pretty annoying. Luckily it's mostly from Amazon so returning it should be free and relatively easy, as long as they accept the reasons for return.

I've tried running an extension cable from another room to power the server and whilst this improves it, the interference still knocks about 60% off my internet speeds.

I would use a wireless ethernet adaptor but the ADSL router is on a different floor and wireless connectivity isn't that hot where I need it. I probably need to shell out and get where the phone enters the house moved to where I need it.

 

[TLE]

I probably need to shell out and get where the phone enters the house moved to where I need it.

I'm sure you’re more than capable of doing that MT? I moved my NTE5 box as it wasn't where I wanted. I know you’re not supposed too, but what the hell.

 

[MobileTechie]

I'm sure you’re more than capable of doing that MT? I moved my NTE5 box as it wasn't where I wanted. I know you’re not supposed too, but what the hell.

That's a good point actually. It's just wires.

 

[TLE]

Its easy...he says

I bought some 2 core BT cable and some BT Gel crimps off Ebay so that it all looked offcial. I then ran that from the white Demarc box in our Porch to a new NTE5 box which had the filter built into it and splits the signal at the entry point to help reduce the noise attenuation. Here's a couple of links for you.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/10-Telephone-cable-connector-crimps-3-wire-gel-filled-/250614157356?pt=UK_Computing_NetworkingTools_Accessories_SM&hash=item3a59c4902c

http://www.clarity.it/xcart/product.php?productid=16134&cat=262&page=1

 

[mjbasford]

Instead of all the trouble of running the new coax for the demarc, why not just hardwire an ethernet drop to the server? Imo that would be the ideal setup

 

[MobileTechie]

Because it's in my house. I can't be drilling holes in walls and running cables.

 

[westom]

I thought it was down to DNS errors and so on but it turns out that the PSU inside PC is producing electrical noise which is messing with my Powerline/Homeplug ethernet connection.

Creating noise or eating those Powerline signals? If making assumptions only from observation, then a power supply can eat (short out) those signals and produce same symptoms.

Either way, a power supply is required to have filters that make both problems impossible. However, responsibility for meeting those standards does not fall upon the power supply manufacturer. All responsibility for meeting those standards falls upon the system assembler. So it is legal to sell power supplies missing those essential functions including filtering.

You could spend maybe £8 for a common mode line filter from companies such as Schurter, Corcom, and Interpower. Power the server though that series mode filter that should have already been inside the power supply. To do what is often missing in power supplies sold to computer assemblers.

No surge protector will sold or claims to even address your problem. In fact, surge protectors can make the problem worse.

Homes have nothing that would impede wireless signals (except heat ducts and concrete walls). Wood to wireless signals is transparent. Heat ducts are not. Locate wireless antennas so that the signal (that radiates out the side - not the end) is not obstructed by heat ducts and other opaque materials. Wood, wall board, etc are transparent to wireless signals. View your building like a radio wave would.

 

[MobileTechie]

Creating noise or eating those Powerline signals? If making assumptions only from observation, then a power supply can eat (short out) those signals and produce same symptoms.

Either way, a power supply is required to have filters that make both problems impossible. However, responsibility for meeting those standards does not fall upon the power supply manufacturer. All responsibility for meeting those standards falls upon the system assembler. So it is legal to sell power supplies missing those essential functions including filtering.

You could spend maybe £8 for a common mode line filter from companies such as Schurter, Corcom, and Interpower. Power the server though that series mode filter that should have already been inside the power supply. To do what is often missing in power supplies sold to computer assemblers.

I've no idea. All I know is that powerline doesn't work when that PC is plugged in.

Could you link me to an example of one of these line filters please so I know what I'm looking for?

 

[TLE]

Power conditioners do the same job, we use them on all of our Disco equipment to get rid of any line noise produced by EMI and RFI. Audiophiles also use them for the same reason.

http://www.google.co.uk/products?hl=en&cr=countryUK%7CcountryGB&q=power+conditioner+uk&wrapid=tlif129564542571410&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=Afw5Tfe2J8yIhQeM2qnMCg&sa=X&oi=mode_link&ct=mode&cd=5&ved=0CCkQ_AUoBA

 

[westom]

Could you link me to an example of one of these line filters please so I know what I'm looking for?

First, if your power supply does not come with a full page of specs - that also define that filter - then assume the always required filter is missing to increase profits.

Second, some examples that you can put inside an extension cord constructed with the receptacle inside a metal (and safety grounded) box:
Well the site has some silly restriction on new posters. So you must reconstruct useful URLs:
Triple W dot schurterinc.com slash products/usa/pemfilter dot asp
Triple W dot schurterinc.com slash products/usa/blockfilters1 dot asp
Triple W dot corcom dotcom
Triple W dot cor.com slash PDF/Q.pdf
Triple W dot interpower.com slash ic/p30-35list dot asp
Triple W dot interpower.com slash scripts/wsisa.dll/WService=ic/p35list2.p?only_filter=YES

Don't know if all links are still valid. Retail salesmen love to keep changing addresses as it doing something productive.

Third, another URL that might be relevant. Remember, power all over the world is same with only minor circuit differences. Which is why same filters are (should be) inside electronics everywhere:
Triple W dot ethanwiner dot com slash dimmers.html

Fourth, locate an AM (longwave) radio adjacent to the computer. Does the computer cause radio interference? Then the computer does not meet national and international standards. It is radiating noise. If not, then your system is probably 'eating' Powerline signals. An example of how to know rather than just assuming it must be generating noise.

 

[westom]

Power conditioners do the same job,

Most line conditioners are only £4 surge protectors repackaged and relabeled as 'line conditioners' to sell for £40 to the most naive. Where are spec numbers for the conditioning? For example, the Lindy claims no "line conditioning" in numeric specs. Impedance in its power cord could do the entire "line conditioning". So they are not lying. Just hyping near zero "line conditioning" to people who all but beg to be scammed.

Any recommendation without hard facts and tech spec numbers should always be regarded first as a probably scam. I see nothing in that post or in the recommend Lindy line conditioner that does anything but enrich the manufacturer. Honest recommendations always come with reasons why and relevant tech spec numbers.

 

[TLE]

I see nothing in that post or in the recommend Lindy line conditioner that does anything but enrich the manufacturer. Honest recommendations always come with reasons why and relevant tech spec numbers.

To be fair, I never recommended any product let alone Lindy. As with anything you get what you pay for, which is why any kind of conditioner is proberbly not the solutions to MT's problem. Myself and others were merely offering some suggestions as to what he could do. I'm sure MT would fully investigate any solutions before he went ahead with it.

However thank you for the information.

 

[westom]

As with anything you get what you pay for, which is why any kind of conditioner is proberbly not the solutions to MT's problem.

When it comes to "line conditioners" (and surge protectors), the most expensive products tend to do the least.

Price says nothing. Informed consumers start with the only place that lies cannot exist - manufacturer's numeric specs.

Some products have no specs. The first indication that it is probably a scam and is probably selling at a highest price. By putting obscene profits into advertising, then a majority will believe it.

It is what my father so enjoyed doing. So many will only believe the first thing they are told. Then when facts and numbers arrive, they will even get angry; aggressively deny. When the government demanded more truth in advertising, well, he said it took the fun out of it.

If you make any recommendation without facts and numbers - the always required reasons why - then you are why my father so enjoyed advertising. He so enjoyed manipulating people who all but begged to be manipulated. So many people also believed smoking increases health. Advertising said so. And were so angry when the Surgeon General reported that smoking is unhealthy. Scams are that easily promoted because so many deny they are so easily manipulated. Even forget what was taught in junior high school science.

 

[TLE]

When it comes to "line conditioners" (and surge protectors), the most expensive products tend to do the least.

Sounds like your opinion rather than fact.

Price says nothing. Informed consumers start with the only place that lies cannot exist - manufacturer's numeric specs.

That is why I always thoroughly research what I am buying.

If you make any recommendation without facts and numbers - the always required reasons why - then you are why my father so enjoyed advertising. He so enjoyed manipulating people who all but begged to be manipulated.

As I said before, I never recommended a product, I simply made a suggestion. There is a huge difference.

I'm tired, it's late and we have hijacked Mt's thread (Sorry MT), and I feel like you're patronizing me now. Goodnight!!

 

[MobileTechie]

Anyway - I just sent the case back and got a new one. Now it's all running just fine.

The new case is better anyway and I added a better quality Corsair PSU. With the better thermal design of the case and the Corsair's larger fan the case doesn't need a seperate case-fan to keep temps low and so it's nearly silent which is ideal for a 24/7 server.