Requesting advice on failed hard drive and new ICB.

[cbsnyder87]

Hello all,

OK, so I'll make this synopsis as short as possible.

-Went to client's home for data transfer from old dinosaur Win 98 desktop to new laptop. Client is elderly, has sentimental files on the old PC (husband and brother's funeral eulogy's, among other things), really needs the data transferred to new PC.
- Booted up dinosaur, started right up and ran great.
- Connect thumb-drive, not recognized (no surprise).
- Attempted to find driver but Win 98 requested install disc to search for drivers. Client doesn't have install disc (no surprise again).
- Removed HDD from dinosaur, connected it to a SATA/IDE USB interface and connected the Molex power cord. Turned on power switch. POOF...motor drive controller went up in smoke.

MOTHA-F*#*#$&*((*&(&*#)@*!!!!!!!!!!!

- Had internal argument with myself to lie to the little old lady, tell her the data is untransferable, put everything back together, and when she started it up next time (probably 2 years from now) she would think it's just dead.
- Decided I won't run business that way and told her what happened. Offered to order a new ICB and replace it for free. Offer accepted.
- HDD is a Maxtor and Maxtor ICB's do not require the BIOS chip to be transferred over, so ordered new ICB from DonorDrivesLLC and installed it today.

Here's the real problem:

The HDD now spins up, you can hear the heads moving, but the PC refuses to boot. Gives "Master Hard Drive Failure" error. Double-checked connections - GOOD. Double-checked master/slave jumpers - GOOD. Double-checked BIOS is set up to boot to HDD - GOOD.

I am terrified of using the Molex power cable of my USB interface, so I left the Molex of the PC's power supply connected and connected just the data connection of my USB interface to 3 different laptops (1 Vista, and 2 Win 8).

All 3 state the drive is unreadable and needs to be reformatted.

MOTHA-F*(#&(@&(*#&%#$)%(!!!!!!!!

CMD>MSCONFIG>Computer Management>Storage Devices... HEY! The drive is mounted and healthy. Oh wait... File System = RAW.

.............MOTHA-F(*$#&(@&(*#$%&)(&!!!!!!!!

Busted out Macrium Reflect to make a clone, reformat the HDD, and transfer the clone back to it. Macirum can't read the file system....

Busted out Recuva Pro to recover data and at least get her the files...screw the old computer. Recuva can't read the file system...

QUESTION 1:

Does anyone out there know if the file system data is stored on the ICB or is part of how the data itself is stored on the HDD?

I am 99.99999% certain it's the new ICB that is not formatted correctly. Why? Because the data on the drive was perfectly readable and working prior to the motor controller burning up on the last ICB.

If so, can I format JUST the ICB. In other words, remove it from the HDD, connect it to power and data, format it to NTFS, and the reinstal it?

QUESTION 2:

Recuva has a "recover from formatted drives" option. Should I go ahead with the reformat and then do a Deep Scan with recuva?

Since no data is being written or has been written to the disk since the ICB failure, would I have a high chance of recovery?

Thanks to anyone who answers!!

 

[pcpete]

Under no circumstances would you format the drive, that would just make it worse.

If you got the correct board with the correct firmware you should not have to do anything to the board. The only rational thing to do is try and make a bit by bit image to a different hard drive. Then run the recovery software on the clone you created.

 

[cbsnyder87]

Under no circumstances would you format the drive, that would just make it worse.

If you got the correct board with the correct firmware you should not have to do anything to the board. The only rational thing to do is try and make a bit by bit image to a different hard drive. Then run the recovery software on the clone you created.

That's exactly what I was thinking, but when I tried to use Macrium to do the clone it simply won't read the data because of the file system being RAW.

Do you know of any cloning software which will get the job done on RAW file systems?

 

[pcpete]

https://www.technibble.com/forums/resources/advanced-guide-to-ddrescue.10/

 

[FremontPC]

Just make sure you get the source and the target right.

You could also check out:

http://www.roadkil.net/program.php?ProgramID=22

 

[pcpete]

One of ddresuce's biggest strengths is it allows you to create a log file which allows you start and stop the job multiple times without ever having to lose the progress you already made. That feature is a nessesity for any serious/professional data recovery.

 

[FremontPC]

Good point, pcpete. Roadkil's "Raw Copy" will get the job done if there are no problems with the platter(s) and all the data can be read, but if parts of the disk are difficult to read, ddrescue has some very handy options.

If you are going to copy the drive to a different drive, you may need to use something like Testdisk to repair the partition table once the clone is done. Win98 uses FAT32 on the system partition so NTFS doesn't enter into the equation. Leave the original disk as it is, just incase you need to start over.

 

[Larry Sabo]

You should always create a sector-by-sector image/clone of drives with a RAW partition, otherwise, you won't be able to scan the image/clone to recover the files. The reason being, the MFT for the RAW partition is hosed and the imaging/cloning software works on file systems--which it can't find without the MFT. Never restore an image to the patient drive, or you will destroy any chance of recovering the data from the RAW partition. Have you looked at Easeus Todo, or AOMEI Backupper as alternatives to Macrium Reflect?

The power problem was not your fault, but it may have damaged the pre-amp or read/write heads within the drive as well as corrupted the firmware and/or user data. I'm not sure it could damage the heads, but the pre-amp for sure. If a trial version of R-Studio, GetDataBack, DMDE or Restorer Ultimate can't find the data, I'm afraid it's gone unless you take it to a data recovery specialist. The specialist may be able to use a backup of the MFT to get the files, names and structures intact.

I'm not sure how I would handle the loss of the data with your client. You might explain what happened to them and tell them you are doing your best to recover the data, but it may be impossible. They may feel it's not as big a deal as you think.

 

[Markverhyden]

Wow!!! Nothing personal but you need to work on your data recovery procedures and processes. Even for little old ladies I'll still treat the data like anyone else's. Once you go the drive running you should have just imaged it and then work on the image. Never touch the source drive unless you need to try to get another image.

There are some threads in the Resources section that can help you out with that.

Knowing it was W98 I'd have just booted up from a *nix CD, plugged in a USB stick, and grabbed the data.

 

[lcoughey]

There is a chance that the pcb doesn't have the correct head map information in it and you may be just making things worse. I would recommend transferring the ROM from patient to donor to be sure that everything is a match.

 

[Matthew Bradley]

Did you plug the molex in backwards?? I've always wondered - much like USB - how on Earth can people plug these things in the wrong way but I see it all the time. My God, if it doesn't fit, stop jamming it.

Also, are you sure it isn't the TVS diode that burned out? I'd hate if you went through all this trouble where a simple solder job would have fixed it.

 

[lcoughey]

[QUOTE="cbsnyder87, post: 495364, member: 115448"
Recuva has a "recover from formatted drives" option. Should I go ahead with the reformat and then do a Deep Scan with recuva?

Since no data is being written or has been written to the disk since the ICB failure, would I have a high chance of recovery?
[/QUOTE]
No offense, but if you are asking this, you probably shouldn't be messing with your client’s drive.

 

[cbsnyder87]

For those who gave constructive responses, thank you.

I realize the path I choose to get the data for this client may not be "conventional". But as I mentioned, I was making the synopsis as quick as possible.

The PC has 64MB of RAM. Not enough to run any of the Live CD's I have, even on "Low RAM" settings. So booting to a CD was not an option, which is why I opted for removing the drive and connecting it via USB. I've done this tons of times on other client's and my own PCs and its never, ever been a problem. Not once. I grab the data (or take an image) and its done.

Rather than spend my post defending myself, which isn't the point, I will say that after trying several options laid out by several of you, I've realized that there is an issue with how the drive is accessing its own data. I'm not sure exactly what (firmware, damaged heads, pre-amp...) but EASEUS and Roadkil's Raw Copy both attempt to grab data from the drive but the same repeating sounds come from the drive. A series of 3 quick clicks, followed by 2 longer clicks.

I've opted to call the client up and tell her the data is unrecoverable.

The day the drive fried and I broke the news to her she told me not to worry; the computer is an old dinosaur and it was bound to break. I explained to her that the drive was damaged as a result of my equipment, so I will do my best to make it right.

I've done my best. If she sues me, she sues me. If she gives me bad word of mouth, fine.

I'm satisfied knowing I did all I can with the knowledge I have.

 

[Larry Sabo]

Did you plug the molex in backwards?? I've always wondered - much like USB - how on Earth can people plug these things in the wrong way but I see it all the time. My God, if it doesn't fit, stop jamming it.

I fried one of my own drives years ago by fumbling with the molex connector in a poorly-lit case. Since then, I have a rule: NEVER try to connect a molex connector while it's live. I hadn't tried to force it, just touched the ends while trying to insert the connector and discovering it was reversed. Easy to do.

 

[Larry Sabo]

I've opted to call the client up and tell her the data is unrecoverable.

Have you tried transferring the ROM from the patient to the donor? That may be all it'll require. If it were a TVS diode, the PSU would clamp and the computer would shut down immediately or would not start at all if it were off when you connected the drive. If it were a fried pre-amp, the drive wouldn't spin at all, in most cases. So there is still a chance to recover the data. If you transfer the ROM, take a picture of it first, so you don't install it reversed. And don't overheat the ROM or you will lose its contents: ChipQuik low-temp alloy (Bismuth) should help.

 

[cbsnyder87]

Have you tried transferring the ROM from the patient to the donor? That may be all it'll require. If it were a TVS diode, the PSU would clamp and the computer would shut down immediately or would not start at all if it were off when you connected the drive. If it were a fried pre-amp, the drive wouldn't spin at all, in most cases. So there is still a chance to recover the data. If you transfer the ROM, take a picture of it first, so you don't install it reversed. And don't overheat the ROM or you will lose its contents: ChipQuik low-temp alloy (Bismuth) should help.

According to several sources I've looked up (including where I bought the new PCB from: donordrives.com), older Maxtor PCB's do not require a ROM swap. Just swap PCBs and go.

It's possible that the BIOS data was contained on the original control chip, which is what burned up. There is a visible burn mark right on the top of this chip, so I know the issue doesn't lie elsewhere.

I've wrote an email to the place I purchased the PCB from asking for their recommendations. Once they reply, and if there is no solution, I'll be at my wits end for recovering the data in this instance so I'll have to break it to the customer.

 

[pcpete]

Correlation is not causation: it may have just been coincidence. Unless you know you put the molex in upside down, I would not assume your psu caused the issue. I personally would not have taken blame for something that may or may not have been from your hardware. There is no reason to put that negative thought in their head to grow to something larger. Instead I would have just gave the facts: the drive went bad, it may have been caused by the tool or it may have went bad for other reasons; either way as a courtesy I would like to help you recover the data.

 

[Markverhyden]

Forgot to mention earlier. Kudos for being honest with the EU. That's the only way to run a business. No matter how painful it may be.

I've had minimal luck with the PCB swap thing. The 2 or 3 times I got it to work, back in the PATA days, was when I pulled the board off of a brand new drive and plugged it into the failed drive - exact same models. And those drive failures had not failed like yours did. They just stopped spinning one day. Others with the same failure mode did not work with the swap.

Great point on the RAM requirements on Linux. You are correct. Even a boot to cli on a normal distro will not work.

At any rate the EU seems to be OK about it. We've all used those USB adapters. Over the years I've had a HD or two as well as a couple of ODD's fry during normal use but I never tried to resurrect the HD's. Given the post swap symptoms you described something else may have happened as well. Did the vendor confirm the board came from the exact same model? The symptom you described makes me wonder if the new board may be different from a firmware perspective.

 

[JustInspired]

Not really to do with recovering data but I myself have burnt out a laptop PATA drive using a converter/adapter. In this case it wasn't USB but a converter to take it to the larger (desktop) IDE cable.
The small IDE connector that goes on the laptop drive was not 'keyed' in that it was not missing the hole on the bottom row of pins. This meant that it was possible to connect it upside down and fry the drive.

I have since gotten a replacement that will not allow the cable to go on the wrong way.

 

[HFultzjr]

IMHO,

Not to be nit picky, but to help you learn.

When you heard "Client is elderly, has sentimental files on the old PC (husband and brother's funeral eulogy's, among other things), really needs the data transferred to new PC" ..........What is the condition of the drive......bit by bit, with ddresccue image FIRST THING DONE. Any issues doing that, or drive showed errors, SEND TO Professionals.

ALWAYS work from the image (have 2 copies, one to work on and one for backup).

This is true for all systems, but more so for an older win 98 machine.

I know that some people balk at the price of Professional recovery, but it boils down to how much do they value their data. If price becomes a no go, explain to them the consequences and risks involved, cover your butt, and do your best. But always get 2 good images first.

I know, this takes what sounds like a "copy data to new drive" from a simple procedure to a higher level, but when I hear "Client is elderly, has sentimental files on the old PC (husband and brother's funeral eulogy's, among other things), really needs the data transferred to new PC', take a step back, look at what you are going to do and re-evaluate.

I'm currently working on a customer's massive (150+GB) i-tunes library. You can make dang sure, the first thing I did was make sure I had a good back-up of his files, before proceeding. He had stated, he would be devastated if he lost his collection. When I'm finished doing what I'm doing, I'm going to give him an updated image of his entire system along with a solid backup program/procedure. When I explained what I was doing, why, and the costs vs. just moving his massive library, (of which he had no backup of), he appreciated what I explained to him and why I was doing it that way, we are moving ahead. He values his data and is willing to do it right, rather than have any, (insert whatever here), work on it and tell him, "oh man, your drive was bad and had errors, sorry but your library is gone".

Long story short.......IMPORTANT DATA, work from multiple images and at the 1st sign of issues....STOP. Proceed to Professional recovery. If customer doesn't want to pay for it, explain the risks involved, cover your butt, and ALWAYS work from an image.

Good luck.