[SOLVED] NBN Phone over wireless bridge

[glennd]

Here's a question that had me stumped.

Customer has NBN connected, FTTN I think. He has the nbn modem/router which has the telephone connected and the LAN switch for internet. He wants to set up a wireless bridge (Nanobeams) to a second building and have the network and telephone both operating in both buildings.

Now, extending the lan across the bridge is ok. What I can't seem to fathom is how to make the telephone get across the bridge as well. The telephone of course is VOIP, being NBN.

Any ideas?

 

[GTP]

Contact the ISP and ask if its possible?

 

[glennd]

Contact the ISP and ask if its possible?

Tried to call Telstra support lately?

I think it's possible to send the analogue phone over the bridge using an ATA adapter on each side. It would look the same as plugging all your analogue phones into one socket.

 

[Sky-Knight]

Nanobeams extend whatever you make them extend. They are layer 2 devices, and as such behave as if they were patch cables running between the two locations.

There's nothing to reconfigure or change, just get the bridge working, plug in a switch on the far side, and plugin your devices. They'll get the SAME IP addresses from the same DHCP server already in use, and the devices in question won't know, nor care about the existence of the wireless bridge.

Now, if your ISP provided device is outputting TWO networks, now you need MANAGED switches on both sides, so you can extend VLANs over the bridge. The switches take untagged traffic from one side, tag it, pass it over the bridge, untag it and pass it to the device and vice versa. This is VLAN 101 stuff!

Now, those bridges are so cheap, you might find it easier to just install two bridges... depends on the time it takes for you to get your head around VLAN.

 

[glennd]

I think I didn't explain myself very well. The phone devices are analog, the vdsl modem/router converts it all to voip. So the 2 questions are how to get an analog phone over the bridge and/or will plugging in a voip phone in to the router connect to the provider sip. I don't know if this is an Australia specific question given the nature of nbn or if other countries have a similar system.

 

[Sky-Knight]

Ahh you need one of these: http://www.grandstream.com/products/gateways-and-atas/analog-telephone-adaptors/product/ht813

Then you can plug a VoIP Phone into it.

FXO port means connected to the CO, the ISP wouldn't know that gateway is any different than a regular phone.

 

[glennd]

Ahh you need one of these: http://www.grandstream.com/products/gateways-and-atas/analog-telephone-adaptors/product/ht813

Then you can plug a VoIP Phone into it.

FXO port means connected to the CO, the ISP wouldn't know that gateway is any different than a regular phone.

I presume I can plug a VOIP phone straight in to the back of the router? Or in fact anywhere on the LAN that's connected to the VDSL modem/router? But that's not the issue...

What this device *will* allow me to do is convert an analogue phone to VOIP to get it on to the network and over the bridge and into the router. But where does that leave me? Does that automatically hook into the SIP provided by the ISP?

This is probably the clearest explanation of FXS/FXO I've read:
https://www.voipsupply.com/blog/voip-insider/fxs-and-fxo-you-should-be-in-the-know/

I think at this point I need to learn more about the particular VDSL modem/router in question so see how it's SIP phone implementation works.

 

[Sky-Knight]

You have a router / MTA combo that's spitting out PSTN. I don't know how things work down under, but here in the states the ISPs almost never give you a SIP option for those lines.

The gateway I linked has a single FXO port that will connect to the very same place and operate just the same as the plain old boring phone you reported you currently have. It then creates a SIP device you can aim a SIP phone at. The ISP doesn't need to know its there, they won't care, all they'll see is a PSTN device working as it always has.

Your customer however, now has a network aware communications circuit that works over their bridge. If you have a PSTN port on the MTA, you don't have a SIP service... so I'm confused as to how you can be confused. But if the VDSL device / ISP can just drop the PSTN hand off entirely and offer a SIP connector, then yeah... you can skip the MTA and simply connect a SIP phone to their provided SIP service.

 

[glennd]

This is what I have in mind. Will Analogue Phone 2 work?

 

[Sky-Knight]

No... this won't work... Assuming both phones are on the same line...

HT813 will have to plug into the VDSL Router where Analogue Phone 1 is via phone cable on its FXO port, and connect via network to the switch, you'll need another HT813 to make the VoIP Analogue again via its FXS port to connect Analogue Phone 2.

To reconnect Analogue Phone 1, you'll have to use a PSTN splitter on the VDSL Modem so you can connect both the phone and the gateway to the same port.

Bear in mind here I'm talking a SINGLE PSTN LINE, not TWO, not THREE... ONE LINE.

 

[glennd]

No... this won't work... Assuming both phones are on the same line...

By "same line" we mean we need them to use the same sip. That RJ11 Phone socket on the modem is FXS, not PSTN. My bad, I'll update the diagram. There's no PSTN. There is only NBN.

I'm guessing that Analogue Phone 2 coming in via the LAN is not going to use the sip configured in the modem, the same sip that Analogue Phone 1 is using.

 

[Sudhir]

Here's a question that had me stumped.

Customer has NBN connected, FTTN I think. He has the nbn modem/router which has the telephone connected and the LAN switch for internet. He wants to set up a wireless bridge (Nanobeams) to a second building and have the network and telephone both operating in both buildings.

Now, extending the lan across the bridge is ok. What I can't seem to fathom is how to make the telephone get across the bridge as well. The telephone of course is VOIP, being NBN.

Any ideas?

have you considered Analogue Telephone Adapter ATA take a look at Linksys SPA3102 this may solve your challenge, good luck

 

[Sky-Knight]

Ok... I'm somehow not being clear?

Analog phones don't use SIP... ever. They aren't SIP devices. So where is SIP in this picture? If the ISP is dropping you analog lines out the back of a router somewhere, that isn't SIP... It doesn't matter if SIP is used by the provider to get the lines there...

If it's hanging off an FXS port on a device that is now a PSTN LINE nothing more, nothing less. And you cannot extend PSTN over an Ethernetwork. That is, unless you use the gateways I indicated above as a bridge, or... you terminate them into an MTA to spit it out SIP, and you use a SIP phone to connect to the MTA.

Or, you remove the stupid phone entirely and go with a phone service that simply delivers the service as SIP, and you have SIP phones and all this ancient analog crap is gone forever.

Two VoIP Handsets connected to the same SIP Trunk is NOT THE SAME as two PSTN devices spliced into the same wire. They aren't even directly comparable.

So we're right back to where we started... what are you trying to accomplish, and how much expansion are you expecting?

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

Most VoIP biz phone providers will have equipment options such as.....new desktop phone sets which are VoIP (ethernet)....to replace the old analog. Or ...little ATA (analog telephone adapters) to convert the old sets to VoIP (ethernet...basically a bridge to ethernet).

One you have phone sets ultimately ending in an ethernet connection...."Yes" what you're seeking to do connecting two buildings with a wireless bridge such as nanobeams works fine. As the two buildings are on the same flat LAT. Wireless bridges are just like an invisible ethernet cable. Just judge the expected load and connection rate....and get a unit with enough horsepower. When setup properly..they really don't add much latency at all in the link. Of course latency is important when it comes to things like VoIP. I have an airFiber link over 6 miles of ocean...barely adds 2-3ms and I have VoIP going across it.