Customer has no money for finished on-site work!!

[Tony_Scarpelli]

Also needed for written contracts/agreements are selling of physical property (computers for example) worth more than $500.

In this situation, the verbal agreement doesn't matter, it's the piece of paper he signed. Take that piece of paper to court, judge will take a look at it, and side with you. Case closed.

For the purposes of Computer IT companies selling and delivering Computer, network and technology solutions the following applies:

In the United States, contracts for the sale of goods where the price equals $500 or more (with the exception of professional merchants performing their normal business transactions, or any custom-made items designed for one specific buyer) fall under the statute of frauds under the Uniform Commercial Code (article 2, section 201).[2] The most recent revision of UCC § 2-201 increases the triggering point for the UCC Statute of Frauds to $5,000, but as of 2006 no U.S. state has adopted revised Section 201.

If your customer buys a computer from you and you give him an invoice that becomes the contract. You have a time, place, listed product/description, price/terms.

 

[JAG Computers]

For the purposes of Computer IT companies selling and delivering Computer, network and technology solutions the following applies:

In the United States, contracts for the sale of goods where the price equals $500 or more (with the exception of professional merchants performing their normal business transactions, or any custom-made items designed for one specific buyer) fall under the statute of frauds under the Uniform Commercial Code (article 2, section 201).[2] The most recent revision of UCC § 2-201 increases the triggering point for the UCC Statute of Frauds to $5,000, but as of 2006 no U.S. state has adopted revised Section 201.

If your customer buys a computer from you and you give him an invoice that becomes the contract. You have a time, place, listed product/description, price/terms.

Please do not cite Wikipedia as an authoritative source.

 

[Shinitenshi]

As others have said, i would have taken the check and expected it to bounce to establish a paper trail. In California, if someone knowingly writes you a bad check (ie. the check bounces and they fail to remedy this), you can take them to small claims court and collect up to 3x the face value of the check.

Also, if you don't want to go to court you can contact their bank and tell them you have a problem with collecting from the check writer. I think for a nominal fee the bank will monitor the account and as soon as the account as sufficient funds they will cash the check for you. The problem with this is you have to wait/hope there is sufficient funds in the account.

I live in California and 3x the amount! I like the sound of that.

Well in California theirs a mechanics/technicians lien can be placed. I my self have never done it but I know a few that actually went into a business that decided they weren't going to pay and just took the computers.

I haven't started a business yet but this thread makes things sound exciting! xD BTW I like some of the answers people have posted here how to solve this issue. Thanks for posting this "fox"

 

[Tony_Scarpelli]

Please do not cite Wikipedia as an authoritative source.

I pulled it from an attorneys web site so he must have linked to it.

 

[homebase]

Depends on the state. In California, all you need to win in the case of a bounced check is the bounced check and maybe something showing you tried to rectify it without the courts(like calling them). And the only way you won't be awarded three times the amount is if they can show a hardship. In most cases, that's irrelevant, as they don't even show up.

This is actually pretty bad advice. California law is very specific about the process that must take place in order to be awarded the triple damages, and maybe just calling them won't cut it. There is also no consideration given to the check writer in the event of financial hardship.

It's California Civil Code Section 1719, if you're interested.

 

[Cornerstone Technologies]

I pulled it from an attorneys web site so he must have linked to it.

Something that they teach in college is to vet sources appropriately, no matter where they come from. If you just copied and pasted from some lawyers website, you fail at basic research. Surely research was required for your MBA, as it is in just about every college level course I have ever taken.

 

[ljtechservices]

Cash, check or CC. I don't care how they pay.
Cash could be counterfeit, Checks could bounce. CC's could be stolen.
there's always a risk.

It must be the area I live in.
I receive 99% of my payments by check. only one bounced about 8 years ago.
I rarely get payment the day of service. I just tell them I'll bill them, only had 1 invoice I had to chase down since '90

 

[cprompt]

I think techservices makes a good point about there is always a risk. I also greatly appreciate his comment "It must be the area I live in." I have been watching this thread, and some others, and thinking that we all need to be careful not to assume that what works for us is automatically the right thing for everyone else. My area is extremely rural. The town my store is in has about 600 people. I travel for some of my clients up to 40 or more miles one way. I tend to take pretty much any form of payment from customers without even asking for an ID - that includes checks from an occasional out-of-stater who is up here for the weekend to ski. I have had only 3 - 4 bounced checks over the last 12 years (all local, by the way) - not enough for me to change the way I operate.

Having said that, I probably would NOT operate this way if I were in a large city. The culture in such places is a lot different than the culture here in the country, and what works for me I would not expect would work for someone else. This same idea not only applies to payments, but also general operation of business. I sometimes see posts that suggest there is only one right way to operate a business, but I respectively disagree - I think a lot of those decisions have to be based on the area and the culture of the community you are located in.

 

[agh3]

It must be the area I live in.
I receive 99% of my payments by check. only one bounced about 8 years ago.
I rarely get payment the day of service. I just tell them I'll bill them, only had 1 invoice I had to chase down since '90

Same here for me. I'm about 1.5 hours North of you (my son has played against the Normal High School soccer team the past 2 years...fun drive for a short game )

I've been in business for over 7 years and never had a check bounce [KOW] but I deal mostly with small businesses. However I have had some take an inordinate amount of time to pay when they're cash strapped. Only had one stiff me..and he was a friend at a former employer. I ended up writing the $1500 off after 3 years of him promising every 6 months he'd pay.

 

[layoric]

I have been fuming about this since it happened 2 days ago:

I got a call from someone for a quote. He wanted 6-7 computers internally cleaned at his home business, checked for hardware issues viruses, tuned up etc. Also a new switch (which he provided) installed and a DVD drive and some other stuff installed. I gave him a quote over e-mail and he agreed. I called him to confirm on the phone and mentioned that I only take cash, debit or credit.. no cheques. He said he understood.

So I show up and get to work, he is asking me questions the whole time and being pretty pushy about the way he wants stuff done. So after 4.5 hours I finish and write him up a bill totaling $460.02

"Can I write you a cheque?"

NO YOU CAN'T!!

So with a crabby look he pulls out his wallet. "These probably won't work but here you go.." First card.. declined Second card declined.

He shrugs. so I ask him, "is there a bank nearby?"

I follow him to the bank and stand outside as he spends a LONG time pushing buttons. I see him pushing his card in and out repeatedly and entering his pin. He finally calls me over to show me that the card is locked, and shrugs again.

So I ask him to go to a teller and he explains that this is not his bank. After some discussion and prompting it is decided that I will follow him to his own branch. He spends a LONG time at the teller and finally comes over to me and shrugs again saying his account is empty. There were some cheques that should have cleared that didn't. No apologies or offers to correct things.

So, in frustration I told him to wait, got a service sheet from my car and had him sign an agreement. I wrote. "I xxx, agree to pay xxx of.... in the amount of xxx for services performed at xxx on Sep 20th 2011, by September 24 2011.

So, my question is should I have followed him back to his house and called the police to at least have a record of the incident? I have a feeling I will be sending this to collections. Anyone have any experience with anything like this?

It was really apparent he had no remorse over the issue and seemed more annoyed than anything, which angered me even more.

YAH! The people wrote me a bad check. I tried to do after the fact things just as you did, even went back to try to get the person's device. In the end, I got their device, but they broke it, then gave it to me.

Another time it was JUST like yours. They were told to pay by cash or credit card ONLY. They pretended to pay via paypal/credit card, then tried to say I didn't do things right. In the end, I got the money via a check, in the mail.

Learn like I did. I have a FIRM no check policy now, but only for new customers. Also purchased a better cell phone and a card reader for LIVE credit card transactions. Finally, before ANY work is performed, EVERYONE signs a work-order, AND a terms-conditions form. Within those guidelines I state the above policies, plus the fact that after 60 days of non-payment/device in my possession, their device/equipment becomes mine.

As for specific thoughts on your situation, it seems a little odd to go with the person to the bank, then another bank even... Gives the impression of you being a bail bondsman or something

Getting them to sign something is smart, even smarter is to have them sign BEFORE any work.

If you get the impression someone won't pay or you're going to have a problem with them, you could do a pre-authorization charge on their credit card. May also just be a good idea for any situation where it looks like there will be a bill total above a certain amount. MANY people don't have hundreds of dollars in cash, and several live paycheck to paycheck, relying on credit cards in the interim.

 

[supporter]

YAH! The people wrote me a bad check. I tried to do after the fact things just as you did, even went back to try to get the person's device. In the end, I got their device, but they broke it, then gave it to me.

Another time it was JUST like yours. They were told to pay by cash or credit card ONLY. They pretended to pay via paypal/credit card, then tried to say I didn't do things right. In the end, I got the money via a check, in the mail.

Learn like I did. I have a FIRM no check policy now, but only for new customers. Also purchased a better cell phone and a card reader for LIVE credit card transactions. Finally, before ANY work is performed, EVERYONE signs a work-order, AND a terms-conditions form. Within those guidelines I state the above policies, plus the fact that after 60 days of non-payment/device in my possession, their device/equipment becomes mine.

As for specific thoughts on your situation, it seems a little odd to go with the person to the bank, then another bank even... Gives the impression of you being a bail bondsman or something

Getting them to sign something is smart, even smarter is to have them sign BEFORE any work.

If you get the impression someone won't pay or you're going to have a problem with them, you could do a pre-authorization charge on their credit card. May also just be a good idea for any situation where it looks like there will be a bill total above a certain amount. MANY people don't have hundreds of dollars in cash, and several live paycheck to paycheck, relying on credit cards in the interim.

I agree with you. Signing a work order BEFORE work should be SOP as far as I'm concerned. A no-check policy is good, too, allowing for repeat customers.

OP: Your BS detector was not working apparently (no offense). This guy sounded like trouble, and probably gave you plenty of clues from the start. In those cases, I'd just decline the job, or pre-auth the cc BEFORE doing any work. Problem solved.

 

[Martyn]

I agree. I'm in the process of checking if I can legally include that. As expected he has been unreachable and didn't pay by the 24th. (Surprise). I sent him a registered letter that said I would forward his account for collections if he didn't pay by the 30th of this month.

I received an e-mail that said "You have to wait. I am having family problems. You will hear from me soon"

I replied that he can pay me before the 30th, otherwise after the 30th he will have to call the collection agency directly to resolve the matter with them. I gave him their contact information.

What happened with this, any update?

 

[Holzster]

Did he work out of his house or was that a business? If he has a business show up there when customers are there and don't yell but he will get the picture to handle it quickly. If it was his house go to his business where he works & ask for him, & just tell him you are still waiting for the payment, make sure you ask him with people around, not in a loud voice just normal so others can hear you ask for payments of a job finished.

 

[DirtyDanno]

Did he work out of his house or was that a business? If he has a business show up there when customers are there and don't yell but he will get the picture to handle it quickly. If it was his house go to his business where he works & ask for him, & just tell him you are still waiting for the payment, make sure you ask him with people around, not in a loud voice just normal so others can hear you ask for payments of a job finished.

I would be careful with that. Typically this individual could call the police and claim you are harassing him. Could possibly even cite that you are trespassing.
just my .02

 

[RedFoxComp]

What happened with this, any update?

Update. He never replied, but sent an e-mail after the 30th basically saying 'if you don't want to wait, send me to collections if you want, it will take you longer to get your money.' I replied that he should expect contact from the collections agency and to no longer contact me.

Some deeper digging revealed that:

He is a professional deadbeat. He is living in a rented house and his landlord is suing him because he stopped paying rent and refuses to leave. According to his landlord he is on disability for a back injury and this is how he lives.

He regularly posts for jobs doing data entry in local newspapers, gets someone to work for him for as long as possible without paying them and then moves on to someone else.

A few days after I told him that he should expect contact from the collection agency I received a phone call from him and he said "I'm going bankrupt anyways so have fun getting your money a**hole" with an immediate hangup.

I'm leaving it with the collection agency. The other poster was right though, I ignored my gut feelings because I wanted the work. Live and learn.

 

[papuchazo]

Update. He never replied, but sent an e-mail after the 30th basically saying 'if you don't want to wait, send me to collections if you want, it will take you longer to get your money.' I replied that he should expect contact from the collections agency and to no longer contact me.

Some deeper digging revealed that:

He is a professional deadbeat. He is living in a rented house and his landlord is suing him because he stopped paying rent and refuses to leave. According to his landlord he is on disability for a back injury and this is how he lives.

He regularly posts for jobs doing data entry in local newspapers, gets someone to work for him for as long as possible without paying them and then moves on to someone else.

A few days after I told him that he should expect contact from the collection agency I received a phone call from him and he said "I'm going bankrupt anyways so have fun getting your money a**hole" with an immediate hangup.

I'm leaving it with the collection agency. The other poster was right though, I ignored my gut feelings because I wanted the work. Live and learn.

Holy s! I feel for you. I hope I never have to deal with such a POS customer.

 

[DuaneG]

Wow man, that sucks...
I'm definitely sorry to hear about your situation.
That's incredible he's such a deadbeat, though..

I definitely learned a lesson, though.

 

[tarik]

Update. He never replied, but sent an e-mail after the 30th basically saying 'if you don't want to wait, send me to collections if you want, it will take you longer to get your money.' I replied that he should expect contact from the collections agency and to no longer contact me.

Some deeper digging revealed that:

He is a professional deadbeat. He is living in a rented house and his landlord is suing him because he stopped paying rent and refuses to leave. According to his landlord he is on disability for a back injury and this is how he lives.

He regularly posts for jobs doing data entry in local newspapers, gets someone to work for him for as long as possible without paying them and then moves on to someone else.

A few days after I told him that he should expect contact from the collection agency I received a phone call from him and he said "I'm going bankrupt anyways so have fun getting your money a**hole" with an immediate hangup.

I'm leaving it with the collection agency. The other poster was right though, I ignored my gut feelings because I wanted the work. Live and learn.

DId he go bankrupt then or did you recover the money?

 

[acesdeals]

i dont do mobile work and i am glad you posted this so i can continue to not do it. either that or i would take a deposit via credit card before even coming to their place.

i take cash and credit at my store. checks i dont take, weather or not there is a paper trail it is inconvenient for me. i dont want hassle i prefer to keep things simple and pay the 2% fee for debit or credit transactions.

TIME IS MONEY

if a customer does not pick up their item after 30 dys, they have to BUY IT back from me or i just sell it. mechanics charge storage fees if a car is not picked up. the only time i allow a customer to pick it up late is if they tell me in advance that they are going on vacation, or maybe they were military and had to travel, i am not mean or a dick im fair and i have a business to worry about.

 

[3ft]

I would have definitely taken the check. Here in Kentucky, it's criminal theft by deception. Class A misdemeanor under $500, above $500 is a felony.