HP laptop BIOS password problems

[Appleby]

Hey guys, I've got a machine in here with a weird problem. At first I thought it was just a BIOS password that had locked the customer out. And maybe it is a BIOS password but it's a weird deal. I've never seen anything quite like it.

Here is the deal. HP logos on the back of the laptop LCD cover, HP logo on the front LCD bezel, model name is Compaq 6710b. I guess this is new to me, but I've never seen a HP and Compaq all in one. I know HP owns Compaq, but I guess this Compaq is a model name now? Either way it doesn't matter. When the computer boots I get a screen that says "Power on Password". You cannot enter anything in the box. It responds to NO keys on the keyboard except the Enter key. You can type all you want and nothing appears in the box. If you hit Enter, it just repeats the "Power on Password" with a couple weird symbols. You can hit enter about 3-4 times then it seems to lock up. Weird.

I'm attaching a couple pics I took with my iPhone of the screen. I have no idea how to reset, bypass or crack this, since it won't even let me type a password nor give me a code that can sometimes be used to crack the password.

Thoughts?

 

[SOHO-NZ]

It's from the "Business Range" of Compaq laptops, and designed to be very secure if lost or stolen.

It uses a TPM security module. By design, the screen does not indicate what you have typed for the password -> even more secure. You'll need very specialist knowledge to crack that. I wouldn't bother trying myself. You may also find the whole hard disk is password protected too.

If your customer has legitimate proof of ownership, then they ought to contact HP and see what they suggest.

 

[Appleby]

Thanks I was afraid that. I could tell it was a nice business class laptop, I was just surprised by the HP/Compaq model.

The computer is a long time legit customer's daughter's (daughter is an adult too) and this is a laptop that I believe she purchased through her school or was bought for her...something about her school getting it for her, but it is hers and she owns it. I suspect nothing fishy at all.

I spoke with her on the phone this morning and pretty much gave her the warning that this didn't look good. I explained the difficulty in cracking/removing modern BIOS passwords and told her this looked even worse. She claims she shut the computer down, came back a couple days later and this happened on its own. Knowing how customers are about "forgetting" how it happened or it just "happened on it's own"....I'm sure this is like most BIOS password lockouts I see. The customer got into the BIOS, saw something about password and set it and doesn't know what she typed. I've seen it all before.

Ok if anyone else has any insight that would be great. If not, I'll call HP and see what they say. Sounds like she's out of luck.

 

[RegEdit]

Have you tried OphCrack?

 

[Appleby]

I have not tried OphCrack. To be honest I'm not sure how to use it. I've considered it in other cases but always resolved the problem some other way.

I just chatted with HP and they told me how to find the CMOS battery and go through the obvious steps of resetting it that way. And as expected, it didn't work.

So if cracking it doesn't work, then I'm stuck replacing the motherboard. I haven't replaced a laptop motherboard, since I really just started doing much internal laptop repair over the last year, such as replacing fans, LCD's, inverters etc. I know a full motherboard replacement would be time consuming for someone without a ton of experience. Thoughts on the difficulty?

 

[Hayes]

I think you will be fine mate,

Swapping a motherboard was my first job, and it was just a matter of unscrewing, unplugging everything, and lifting it out.

 

[Appleby]

Thanks. I just checked the prices on the replacement mobos and they are high for this model. $170-$200 on ebay. $300ish from non-eBay sources. I can't imagine the customer is going to want to pay this price because I won't due the work unless I can mark up the motherboard and make good money for my time. I feel there is a certain amount of risk involved in the replacement (as well as time) and I also know that if ANYTHING goes wrong in the next 3-4 months, the daughter will be blaming me for it. Oh, I don't know that, I'm just saying I know how alot of people are. Therefore, on a job this big, if I can't make a good profit, it's not worth the risk and trouble.

I'll let ya know what happens.

 

[B Trevathan]

You may also find the whole hard disk is password protected too.

I too am also thinking that the hard drive might be password protect also, if the user accidentally turned on password protection for power on or BIOS access then they may have also turn it on for the hard drive, I would take the drive out and see if you can access the files before replacing the motherboard.

How long did you wait before replacing the CMOS battery? You might try removing the power and both batteries and holding down the power button for 30 secs to help drain the power out. Where there no jumpers to reset the CMOS settings?

I guess you tried typing in some of the normal passwords like password or school or the users name or 1234 or 0000 or 1111 etc, etc.?

 

[Appleby]

B Trev, that's a good point about the HD. So basically what you are saying is, I could replace the mobo and still have a locked HD and have to wipe it out? Yuck. Excellent point.

As for resetting the password via removing the battery.....I followed the HP tech's instructions, which he copied and pasted from his manual. He mentioned no jumpers. Just to remove all power, remove the CMOS battery, hold the power button for 15 seconds (I held it 15, 30 and even longer on multiple tries), put power back to the pc, boot and see what happens with the CMOS battery still out. Nothing. He claimed at that point it is a full mobo replacement. From what I read online, that is probably what it's going to take. As others have said, being a business class laptop, the BIOS password on alot of these are hard to bypass and that is the feeling I'm getting about this model.

I have not tried the normal passwords, simply because, as I stated above, I couldn't even tell what was going on, since my characters where not showing up in the password prompt. Right after I typed my org. post I talked to HP, that didn't work and I left my office. I'm going to try the defaults tomorrow and call the customer and ask her what she thinks it might be. I personally think, she got into the BIOS and accidentally set it, contrary to the story I got from her on the phone this morning.

Thanks for the help guys, I really appreciate it.

 

[Kitten Kong]

Would a loopback plug be of any use in this situation?

 

[snifferpro]

Panasonic toughbooks also worked as you described with the 3 try, non display
of password.

The panasonic service manual described a loop back plug (actually 2) that would
allow access to the Bios. I made my own loopback plug from the documentation
and was able to get into the bios.

There may also be a single keystroke that will enable access. Look at the keyboard
an see if any key is worn much more than any other.

 

[Fish]

** i have never tried this **
Someone once told me (and it may have been an april fools joke) that bios passwords can sometimes be stored on a type of eeprom that can be reset by freezing - ie temperature.
I have seen car stereo codes reset in this way after 24hrs in the freezer (a long time ago).
As i said, i cant verify if this was a good tip or a wind-up. I would only do it myself with the mobo and as a last resort before buying a new one. I definately wouldnt put any other components in the freezer.

 

[Appleby]

Thanks for the help guys. I talked with the customer and as expected, once I pressed the issue of how the BIOS password got on the computer, I got more of the story....which I expected. She had some guy helping her set the computer up and he set the BIOS password for her. He told her what the password was, but she forgot it. She used the laptop for several days, never shutting it down. She then shut it down, put it in storage and moved. When she got it out of storage last week she found this problem. She called him and he gave her a list of possible passwords, none of which worked when I tried them and all their variations. They were also multi-word passwords with numbers, so there is even more room for error.

She says she just wants the laptop fixed and she's willing to pay. I told her that HP charged $396 for the replacement board, plus my labor but I'd find the board much cheaper. She said she didn't care, just do it. Okie dokie, mobo ordered via eBay.

She was concerned about her finger print scanner....she wanted to know if it would work again and if she would have to re-scan her finger print to set it up or would it still be set to her print? I couldn't answer that question. Oh and for the record, the data is accessible via the HD when it's hooked to another computer, so we should be good to go in that area.

 

[B Trevathan]

Now that you have a new motherboard coming.

Now that you have a new motherboard coming do you want to try jumping the pins on the 24C02 chip on the old motherboard to see if it will reset the password? Here is a link to a page showing how its done on a Dell PC: http://www.darkmagic.org/mike/dell-tag/dell/dell6.html

This what the chip looks like and the pins they say to short.

These pictures do not show the actual size of the chip, the chip is a whole lot smaller!

 

[Appleby]

WOW that looks like a hard little booger to find on the motherboard.lol

Thanks for the link, I think I'm going to try that......