[REQUEST] Processor suggestion

[Kirby]

A month ago I recommended a motherboard to a customer after a way-too-quick look and they ended up getting an Asus Q170T/CSM, a thin mini-itx motherboard. Needless to say, it was no good. So I had to spend $150 to buy it from them.

After a little thought, I decided to build an HTPC. Another $85 for a case (Corsair Obsidian 250D), $40 for a power supply, $65 for memory, $50 for blueray, $35 for remotes (a couple different ones by Rii with keyboards on them)... So I'm up over $400 now for a computer which is going to do almost nothing and I still have no CPU or storage. Actually, I think I'm going to use a 2TB drive I already have in my computer at home for the storage and maybe a laptop HD for the Kodi install (IF I don't break down and get the 250GB SSD I'm looking at...just ONE MORE PART...that's what I keep telling myself).

So, I'm almost there (kind of). Now I need a CPU. I'm looking at i5, quad core, Intel 630 graphics...you know, all the "almost certainly overkill" things. But I don't know what it's going to actually take to smoothly transcode video. The TV isn't 4K, but a future one might be. The video files will be stored locally in a variety of formats and codecs (on the 2TB drive, which will be a separate drive from the OS drive).

I don't need this thing to be a gaming PC. There is no place to add a graphics card on this board, so the CPU has to handle it all and it's 1151. Any suggestions? Do I need the 630 graphics? Can I make do with a 6th gen CPU so that I don't have to get ANOTHER CPU to update the BIOS before I can use a 7th gen CPU in it (actually, I can borrow one, I think)? Can I just look around for a deal on an i3, possibly 2 core? Do these answers change if I upgrade to a 4K TV down the road? I have WAY more into this already than you should have for a computer in this role, so I want to start cutting costs, but I don't want incur more costs by cutting too much and having to buy another part down the road. Thanks.

 

[Kirby]

Lol, NOBODY builds these things! Maybe it's because you can buy one ready to go for $200-$300 and I'll have twice that in this one...

 

[MichaelBits]

It would do video just fine with any i series CPU.
4k is a whole other matter though (for streaming). You need to meet a few requirements for that.

I'm still using an HTPC I built several years ago. Has an AMD A10 CPU. I'm using the on board video, no extra card. It plays my library of movies and TV shows just fine and streams just as well.

Are you talking streaming 4k or playing your own 4k content?

 

[Kirby]

It would do video just fine with any i series CPU.
4k is a whole other matter though (for streaming). You need to meet a few requirements for that.

I'm still using an HTPC I built several years ago. Has an AMD A10 CPU. I'm using the on board video, no extra card. It plays my library of movies and TV shows just fine and streams just as well.

Are you talking streaming 4k or playing your own 4k content?

I don't currently have a 4K TV, but mine is in need of replacing soon, so it's an option for a replacement.

Streaming is handled through Netflix, Hulu and the like, right? I never thought about that, but just assumed it could handle it since there's no transcoding involved.

I don't currently have any 4K content. Just thinking of the future. I guess that the content would need to be 4K for it to be an issue, even if it was going to a 4K TV. And I'm unlikely to actually rip a disk in 4K. It would take too much space, and virtually every movie worth watching was made in the '80s anyway, so there is no 4K disk to rip. Still, if there's a good new movie like Piranha with good nudie bits I might rip it in 4K, but I doubt it.

 

[MichaelBits]

To stream 4k on a PC you need Win 10, series 7 CPU (Kaby Lake), and use Edge as the browser. Only way to stream from the likes of Netflix currently with 4k.

As for ripping 4k discs, not sure how that will work. I haven't explored that yet as I'm waiting a couple years to jump to 4k.

Currently I rip all movies I buy and put them on my media server. I can keep full HD quality and sound from a bluray and take the file size from 25-35G down to 3-5G. I don't really see much noticeable loss in quality. I currently have over 500 movies on my server, and maybe 20ish full TV series.

 

[Kirby]

To stream 4k on a PC you need Win 10, series 7 CPU (Kaby Lake), and use Edge as the browser. Only way to stream from the likes of Netflix currently with 4k.

As for ripping 4k discs, not sure how that will work. I haven't explored that yet as I'm waiting a couple years to jump to 4k.

Currently I rip all movies I buy and put them on my media server. I can keep full HD quality and sound from a bluray and take the file size from 25-35G down to 3-5G. I don't really see much noticeable loss in quality. I currently have over 500 movies on my server, and maybe 20ish full TV series.

That is exactly what I'm talking about, though I'm using Tversity right now, so I have to keep the file size around 1GB or smaller or it caches constantly. In the old days I didn't want to give a shiny new disk to a little kid with no concept of the value of money and questionable hygiene. Then it just became so convenient.

Now, I've accidentally purchased a thin mini-itx motherboard, didn't want to just keep it on a shelf forever, so I decided to build an HTPC. Didn't even know what an HTPC was before then. Never thought about it. I'm looking into probably Kodi. Unfortunately that means I need to learn pretty much EVERYTHING about it to avoid getting any of the illegal addons for it. That means doing a vanilla install and researching, downloading and installing each individual addon myself. Pain in the neck, but I think it will be worth it in the long run.

And the setup is going to be super sweet! It has a bluray drive for playing disks and one of the Rii remotes I bought with a keyboard on the back has programmable infrared buttons, so I will FINALLY have one remote to rule them all! No more 2 or 3 remotes on the stand by my chair, just one that does EVERYTHING I need it to do!

I'm super excited to get it up and going. Unfortunately, I already have a lot of money in it, so I'm getting cautious here near the finish line. I'll definitely have one drive dedicated to nothing but storage and another to nothing but Kodi and its addons just to make it feel "clean". Not sure if I'll spend an extra $100 to do a 250GB SSD card. I like the idea because it just mounts to the motherboard. One fewer things to power with the single power cable from the motherboard and one fewer SATA cables. But I really don't need the extra speed, nor do I need to spend for 1/4 TB of storage about what I could spend for 2TB. Hell, I have a computer shop. I have laptop and desktop drives of all sizes just laying around, so I want to think that I'll go that route because it makes more sense...but the SSD thing is just SO COOL! I think that's its biggest selling point when you don't need the speed. It's a "cleaner build".

Anyway, I was thinking the i5-7400 or maybe 7500 quad core with Intel HD 630 graphics. It's WAY overkill for what I'll likely be doing, but again, so cool. And there's always that future thing. I'm considering an i3, maybe even a 35W i3 so that the thing stays quieter. But I have an Arctic Freezer Xtreme rated at .5 Sones (another $35 I did not previously list), so I really don't think it will be too much an issue. So if I have extra cash when I finally decide maybe I'll even spring for the i7-7700 or something. I have a 150W external power supply for it, so I should be able to use pretty much any processor I want.

And I rambled. Sorry about that. It's an exciting (though WAY expensive) project. And the frigging $15 remote is the part that gives me the biggest stiffy for the whole thing, oddly enough.

 

[Blues]

I don't think you need to worry unless you have your own 4K media that will be transcoded and when do you think you would be upgrading your media to 4K quality the TV doesn't matter. The one point of concern might be if you added a turner to the device then you might need to worry about 4K but again I think for what looks like a project the i5 or i3 will be sufficient. Once the fun is over you can sell it to recover some cost or possibly try mining with it just need to add a video card or two.

 

[MichaelBits]

It has a bluray drive for playing disks

Keep in mind you cannot play bluray discs natively on a PC. You have to buy DVD playing software to do so (there is way to do it without the software, but it's not easy to set up and doesn't always work).

Haven't heard of Tversity. Most use Kodi or Plex... or a combination of the 2.

I use one called Emby, which links into my Windows Media Center (yes I still use it!). I use media center to record and watch TV and to play all my media from my server.
I built a super HTPC several years back. It has 2 tuner cards. One is a 6 tuner cable card, the other a 2 tuner over the air card.
I have 7 HDD's and a blueray drive in it. 4 HDD are 4TB raided together to give me over 11TB of media storage. Main system drive is a 120G SSD plus 2 other drives for miscellaneous use.

I freaking love it hehe... I can stream any of my media to anywhere I have an internet connection. I can stream live TV as well.


To rip the movies from discs to add to my server I use MakeMKV (initial rip from disc) and Handbrake (to convert to more usable format and reduce file size).

 

[Kirby]

I use Handbrake. Great converter. I haven't really played with bluray discs yet. Is there an addon for Kodi that will allow them to play? A legal addon. I don't want any of those letters from my ISP that I've heard about or the recording industry putting out a hit on me and my family.

I was going to get into the tuners years ago, but at that time, anyway, the recording industry had blocked something. Maybe it was the ability for them to receive a digital signal? I don't remember. Anyway they sounded like they would die out, which, of course, is what the industry wanted them to do. Obviously that didn't happen.

It sounds like when you get that thing fired up your power meter spins right off the side of the house. That thing sounds brutal awesome. Way more than I want, though. I would like to stream throughout the house, but I don't need to stream over the Internet. One of my main gripes with what I'm using now is that I have played on the Roku suddenly don't work any more. Not sure if it's codecs on the computer, Tversity configuration or a Roku update, but I'm tired of screwing with it and I don't want to transcode everything I've collected over the years. The main reason for the Kodi system is to play it all natively. Everything I have plays fine on the PC, it just won't stream to the Roku sometimes. I had to transcode something just last night because it had no sound on the Roku or PS3, but was fine on the PC.

But as I said, one of my big motivators is the remote. With one remote, which has a keyboard for YouTube and an air mouse, should I need it, I can control the TV and the player. I only need power, volume, input select and, when it loses power, the "Get the hell out of this stupid menu which won't go away until I hit this button. I don't have a smart TV. Why the hell does it need to know what time it is?" button.

So, you thinking an i3 will work for this? Not that it matters much, really. Why spend $115 on an i3 when I can spend $180 on an i5? It's like $65 more for way more power. But I would kind of like to know what it "needs" so that I know how "future proof" I'm making it.

 

[MichaelBits]

An i3 should suffice for playing and streaming around your network.
Don't have Kodi though I have played with it in the past. Not sure how it streams to other devices...

With my setup, Emby determines how it gets streamed. If it's going out over the internet, it will transcode it to what fits the bandwidth, or what limits I have set. If it's on my internal network, it will stream it direct, no transcoding.

If you plan on using it to do any ripping or video conversions, I would go with i5 for a little more speed when doing it. The desktop I use at home for most ripping and video conversions is a 3rd generation i5.

As for playing Bluray with Kodi, you would still need a 3rd party program such as one from Cyberlink.
Bluray's are heavily protected, and to play them you need the license to access them to play. Buying the licensing for your product to play bluray's is pricey, so none really have it.

 

[Your PCMD]

To stream 4k on a PC you need Win 10, series 7 CPU (Kaby Lake), and use Edge as the browser. Only way to stream from the likes of Netflix currently with 4k.

Sorry, but wrong. I stream 4k with no issues with a simple ASRock H97 iTX and G3258 using a GTX960 through Chrome on my Sony 65" 4k TV.

 

[MichaelBits]

Not according to the Netflix site. They state you can only use Edge or the Win 10 app.
I didn't mention video cards because he said he couldn't add one, but yes, you can avoid the CPU requirement if you have a proper Nvidia card.

 

[MichaelBits]

Straight from the Netflix site: https://help.netflix.com/en/node/23742

Resolution:

• Google Chrome up to 720p
• Internet Explorer up to 1080p
• Microsoft Edge up to 4K*
• Mozilla Firefox up to 720p
• Opera up to 720p
• Safari up to 1080p on Mac OS X 10.10.3 or later

*Streaming in 4K requires an HDCP 2.2 compliant connection to a 4K capable display, Intel's 7th generation Core CPU, and the latest Windows updates. Check with the manufacturer of your system to verify specifications.

It even states Chrome can only do 720P.

 

[Kirby]

That should be all the info I needed. I know I asked if I should go with i3 or i5, but I was already leaning so heavily toward i5 that I was actually considering i7. I think I'll stick with the 7th gen i5 just for the 630 graphics. I think I'll give the SSD a skip for now, though.

As for bluray disks, I had forgotten that the DVD format had been patented and needed a DVD decoder installed to play unless you were using VLC. If I had forgotten that then I would have figured the same was true for bluray. I got a bluray drive for this and everything, too. It looks like PowerDVD is the best software for playing blurays, but I was planning on doing a native Kodi install. I think there's an installer to put down a Linux base to build a box which does nothing else, which is what I had planned. The "main purpose" isn't going to be a media server at all, it's going to be a media center. The server was just a bonus.

There is a lot to learn about this yet. I won't actually start learning more until I get that damned processor. And then I'll probably end up with something that makes me say, "I spent HOW MUCH on this thing?" It seems to be my luck lately. I just keep thinking of a one-remote solution, though, and it keeps me driven to try.

 

[MichaelBits]

I bet you can't beat the remote I use.
As part of my media center server, I also have a Harmony server running on it. This allows me to use a tablet to control my entire system. From the HTPC itself to the 7.1 channel receiver, bluray player, projector, and TV. I have macros setup, so with the touch of the tablet I can switch to bluray player, or even to my projector for instance.

I kind of lucked out on it though. Found an older refurbished Harmony keyboard that came with the Harmony server (Hub I think they call it) for a nice price a couple years ago. They can be hard to find sometimes.

I also have a remote like you mention as well. Has a mini keyboard on one side and a media center style remote on the other.

 

[Kirby]

That does sound cool. I hate Logitech with a passion though. I bout a Harmony remote years ago. Absolutely the dumbest tech I have ever bought. I had to connect it to the computer, which had to be connected to the Internet and required a username and password to change even simple settings. And it was "activity based", which yeah, I'm sure is very nice if that's the way you intend to use it, but it didn't work for my circumstances and there was no way to make it work the way I wanted. One of my biggest pet peeves in life is products which try to dictate how I use them rather than give me the option to use them the way I want.

And Logitech has become a crap brand these days anyway. A few years back I got 2 Logitech wireless keyboard/mouse combos for a customer. One lasted 10 months, the other 14. I ended up replacing both under warranty with Microsoft combos, which still work today. Even more recently I got Logitech headphones for one of my kids. The wire they use is so thin the things lasted a week. Literally a week. You give me Logitech anything and I'll throw it right in the electronics recycling to save me the hassle of hooking it up before I have to throw it in the recycling.

 

[Blues]

I still love Logitech mice and their KB aren't bad. I am however a mechanical KB user and I expect Logitech won't be on my radar anytime soon for a KB.

 

[frase]

I made mine a few weeks ago from Bits n Pieces about- cost $0

I use it for Kodi & RetroArch for my kids [and me ]

Specs are:

• i5 4430
  MS-7817 Mobo
  
• 8GB DDR3
• OnBoard GPU
• 1TB WD BLACK
• Linux Mint

 

[Kirby]

I made mine a few weeks ago from Bits n Pieces about- cost $0

I use it for Kodi & RetroArch for my kids [and me ]

Specs are:

• i5 4430
  MS-7817 Mobo
  
• 8GB DDR3
• OnBoard GPU
• 1TB WD BLACK
• Linux Mint

View attachment 7989

Super sweet. You should look into spending $12 on the Rii MX3 remote: https://www.amazon.com/Rii-Multifunction-Wireless-Keyboard-3-Gsensor/dp/B01CL3ZXGO

I got 2 different ones, but this is the one I'm excited about. Air mouse, keyboard on the back, all buttons are IR programmable so I can use it for the TV and Kodi.

Also, I just read about pi-hole for the first time yesterday. It's a Linux DNS server that blocks thousands of ad-serving domains. I might toss that onto my Kodi system and give it a try. It is supposed to block virtually all advertising network-wide, not just per device.

 

[MichaelBits]

You should look into spending $12 on the Rii MX3 remote: https://www.amazon.com/Rii-Multifunction-Wireless-Keyboard-3-Gsensor/dp/B01CL3ZXGO

That's the remote I mentioned earlier, with a keyboard on the back. First thing you should do is tweak its speed, took me a few to find a comfortable mouse speed so it didn't try and fly off screen or having to do a 3' arc in front of me to move the cursor across the screen.

I had 2 of them... Ex-girlfriend took one, and the other died. I should pick up another, looks cheaper now than when I bought them.