Workarounds for Windows 11 on Incompatible Hardware

[ThatPlace928]

First I've seen of MS officially allowing Win11 on unsupported hardware. I posted somewhere else that I kinda thought this may happen(???).

Microsoft now allowing Windows 11 on older, incompatible PCs

Despite years of warning, it's now officially possible to install Windows 11 on PCs that don't meet requirements — but with a warning and a disclaimer.

www.pcworld.com

Interesting. You can do it but the incompatibility issues and lack of security support would still make most back off. No doubt there will be lots of people upgrading who are willing to take the risk. Not me, though.

 

[britechguy]

First I've seen of MS officially allowing Win11 on unsupported hardware. I posted somewhere else that I kinda thought this may happen(???).

Microsoft now allowing Windows 11 on older, incompatible PCs

Despite years of warning, it's now officially possible to install Windows 11 on PCs that don't meet requirements — but with a warning and a disclaimer.

www.pcworld.com

Well, you could knock me over with a feather! ::NOT::

I also fully expect an extension to the EOL date on Windows 10 to come out, eventually, too.

 

[ThatPlace928]

I also fully expect an extension to the EOL date on Windows 10 to come out, eventually, too.

That's the one I'm expecting to happen, as well.

 

[wavey]

Why not allow windows security updates? I can understand that a PC without TPM 2 could be compromised, but to not allow other security updates seems a bit... Daft?

 

[Sky-Knight]

Not supported is not supported. This isn't a negotiation.

 

[britechguy]

Not supported is not supported. This isn't a negotiation.

You can say that all you want, but it certainly isn't the impression that's being given by Microsoft when they do precisely what they did that's reported in the article offered by @Diggs.

Actions have consequences, and Microsoft is, yet again, muddying the waters. Not supported is now kinda-sorta but not really not supported, by their own hand.

 

[phaZed]

3 weeks ago they said they would be supporting older hardware. A week after that, they said they nixed the whole idea. This week, they're back to supporting older hardware. My take is, nobody knows yet.

Nov 28th - Windows 11 Now Compatible with Older PCs: A Game Changer for Users
Nov 4th - Microsoft reiterates that it will not lower Windows 11 requirements (MSN)
Nov 4th - Microsoft closes the door on Windows 11 supporting older hardware(Verge)
Dec 9th - Microsoft now allowing Windows 11 on older, incompatible PCs

 

[britechguy]

My take is, nobody knows yet.

100% agreement there, but this is yet another example of Microsoft dithering where they either should have planned for a reasonable need/want from the user base, or drawn that line in the sand and kept it.

As Yogi Berra is said to have said: It's deja vu all over again.

 

[HCHTech]

First I've seen of MS officially allowing Win11 on unsupported hardware.

Not unexpected, but still I hate that they have done this.

 

[britechguy]

Not unexpected, but still I hate that they have done this.

I had actually expected them to extend EOL for Windows 10 rather than doing this. And I still expect them to extend EOL for Windows 10 within a couple of months of current EOL date.

 

[fincoder]

My take is, nobody knows yet.

That first and last in that list of articles, the ones asserting that Microsoft is relaxing the requirements, don't actually show evidence pf any such wavering from Microsoft itself. I put the confusion down to bad journalism, which is the default for IT news sites. The first article has no sources at all.

The latest article from PCWorld says this:
Users can now upgrade directly to Windows 11 even without the needed hardware. Microsoft doesn’t explain the actual “upgrading to Windows 11” steps in the document, but we assume...

No link to that mystery document included that I can see, and they admit it doesn't explain the actual process. It only links to their own German language site as a source but not to an actual article (too hard to find the foreign language site).

Everyone in this forum knows Windows 11 has had ways of bypassing requirements from the beginning. These were not hacks, but ways for IT professionals to do it with imaging tools, we can assume Microsoft put them in on purpose. Rufus takes advantage of those bypass methods and makes it easier for everyday techs and enthusiasts.

The only thing that's changed is (apparently) a watermark on the screen noting Windows 11 is not supported on current hardware. Microsoft's language merely assumes some people know how to bypass the requirements, it is not changing the requirements (even unofficially) that I can find evidence of.

I'm happy to be proven wrong, I'd love for Intel 7th gen and maybe TPM 1.0 to be officially supported.

 

[Sky-Knight]

Yeah...

Microsoft not putting a bomb in their code that actively prevents the OS from functioning on an out of support platform is NOT the same as supporting that out of support platform.

And the presence of any such actual bomb is a MASSIVE risk.

The first article I clicked on reads like an AI hallucination.

Because articles online do not make money for being accurate, they make money by being CLICKED ON. And there are an absolute endless pile of idiots that want their ancient junk to run Windows 11 so they don't have to think or change anything.

Social Media means you make bank by feeding people's biases. Subject matter doesn't matter, if you put wishful thinking on blast, you will get traction and return.

 

[NviGate Systems]

With friends like these, who needs enemies?

 

[sapphirescales]

And there are an absolute endless pile of idiots that want their ancient junk to run Windows 11 so they don't have to think or change anything.

Computers are expensive. Not everybody buys $300 Walmart specials. And it's not unreasonable to expect Microsoft to support older hardware. They've done this since forever. That's why people use Windows, backwards compatibility and compatibility with pretty much any hardware. You can get Windows 10 to work on a Pentium 3. It won't be a pleasant experience, but it will absolutely work. However software as a service has ruined this advantage that Windows once had, so they're focusing on subscriptions now. They really need to stop messing with Windows though and adding new features that NO ONE wants or asked for. Keep a consistent UI that works (Windows 7's is probably the easiest and most intuitive) and just provide security updates. You don't see Apple completely changing the UI of their operating system for no reason. You could take someone from 2001 who knew how to use MacOS 10.0 and put them in front of a computer running the latest version of MacOS and they'd have no problem at all. Try doing putting a computer with Windows 11 on it in front of someone who had only used Windows 2000/XP and see how well they'd fare.

 

[britechguy]

They really need to stop messing with Windows though and adding new features that NO ONE wants or asked for.

This plaint has never had validity. You didn't ask for it, I didn't ask for it, but it is entirely possible (probable, really) that members of another user demographic did.

I haven't seen many features added to Windows, or other OSes, that certain people like myself or yourself think are utterly useless where another user demographic doesn't think they're the best thing since sliced bread and couldn't live without them.

OSes are Swiss Army knife affairs, meant to appeal to an incredibly broad array of users with often divergent and competing needs. That means, by definition, that your "junk" feature is another's "savior" feature. That something does not appeal to you (generic you) is utterly irrelevant.

 

[phaZed]

@Sky-Knight

I don't believe that's true. Since Windows 8.1, and of course 10, it required CPU's with eXecute Disable bit, or NX bit.

That would be Opteron 200-series "Sledgehammer" in late 2003-2004 and Pentium(4) M 780 from mid-2005 - or a very select few Intel Socket 478's (2002-2005) and Intel Socket 775 that came out in 2006. So, by 2006, pretty much everything had NX bit, but in 2005 you would have needed a specific chipset and a Intel J-Series Processor or a Opteron.

Also, AGP support was also dropped in Windows 10, which further excludes Win10 support for Intel devices pre-late-2005-2006 and Opteron CPU's pre-2005.

Windows 10 was released in 2016 - 10 or 11 year old hardware being "obsoleted" - just like now. Nothing has changed.

You don't see Apple completely changing the UI of their operating system for no reason.

Which may be why their sales for PC's has flat-lined for the past 15 years at roughly 10-15%. Which may be why they take 5 years to update their PC hardware, selling that same 3-5 year old hardware as "new". Apple seems to be quite notorious for not really working on their PC line at all, for long periods of time. They rather work on pushing people into iPads and iPhones, infamously shunning their entire PC base for a decade at a time. That's not a "feature", that's a failure.

You could take someone from 2001 who knew how to use MacOS 10.0 and put them in front of a computer running the latest version of MacOS and they'd have no problem at all.

Well, that's quite the edge-case for someone to not change OS's in over 20 years. And I really don't think that someone that was using XP would have a hard time in Windows 11.
But what is ironic is that MacOS has had at worst, a 4-year support of their PC's to at best a 9-year support for their OS's and hardware. Not to mention, many of the upgrades were paid-for $80 CD's and such. So, while you complain about Microsoft "not supporting older hardware" - Apple is a shining example of planned obsolescence and the epitome of not supporting older hardware, above and beyond Microsoft in almost every way.

 

[Sky-Knight]

Computers are expensive. Not everybody buys $300 Walmart specials. And it's not unreasonable to expect Microsoft to support older hardware. They've done this since forever. That's why people use Windows, backwards compatibility and compatibility with pretty much any hardware. You can get Windows 10 to work on a Pentium 3. It won't be a pleasant experience, but it will absolutely work. However software as a service has ruined this advantage that Windows once had, so they're focusing on subscriptions now. They really need to stop messing with Windows though and adding new features that NO ONE wants or asked for. Keep a consistent UI that works (Windows 7's is probably the easiest and most intuitive) and just provide security updates. You don't see Apple completely changing the UI of their operating system for no reason. You could take someone from 2001 who knew how to use MacOS 10.0 and put them in front of a computer running the latest version of MacOS and they'd have no problem at all. Try doing putting a computer with Windows 11 on it in front of someone who had only used Windows 2000/XP and see how well they'd fare.

$200 on Amazon and I have a new machine that meets the reqs. These things aren't even worth the time to discuss.

@phaZed Officially, you couldn't run Windows 10 on anything older than a 1st generation iSeries CPU from Intel, because that was when Intel supported Windows 10. In practice we all had much older hardware running. Microsoft can claim support, but the hardware vendors have a voice in that too.

Fast forward today and even that has changed: https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000006105/processors.html

Intel doesn't claim support for Windows 10 until the 3rd generation iSeries, which we all know was silly in terms of what actually worked.

Microsoft still has the published CPU list for Windows 10 1511: https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/w...ed/windows-10-1511-supported-intel-processors

But again, things well beyond this list worked. So I get why people got used to CPU compatibility not really being an effective thing. If it was AMD64 capable, it simply worked. Heck for a long time even that wasn't required, anything i386 capable was good.

But that isn't true for Windows 11. The CPU security features now matter which is why you can go here: https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/w...pported/windows-11-supported-intel-processors And scroll all the way to the bottom to see this bit:
[1] Only select devices that shipped with modern drivers based on Declarative, Componentized, Hardware Support Apps (DCH) design principles.

Because this is the only way for the kernel to trust the hardware, and implement zero trust into the boot process. Windows 11 requires Zero Trust methods, Microsoft made that a standard. And none of us are going to change this fact. Platforms that cannot meet this standard will continue to have issues. Microsoft won't support them, and there are a ton of people that seem to think it's somehow cheaper to pay a human to "fix" this crap, instead of just replacing it. Which again... $200 crap box on Amazon does that job. How many hours can you work on the problem and still be net positive again?

The part that worries me is the CPU compatibility list for Windows 11, which released with 22H2 versioning, is somehow different than the CPUs for Windows 11 22H2/22H3. I can't get a straight answer as to why that learn article has BOTH LISTS, which have a few differences detailed in such a way.

 

[sapphirescales]

Which may be why their sales for PC's has flat-lined for the past 15 years at roughly 10-15%.

No, that would be cost. The majority of people buy cheap PCs. They can't afford to buy a Mac or an expensive PC.

Which may be why they take 5 years to update their PC hardware, selling that same 3-5 year old hardware as "new".

That has changed ever since the M1. And they didn't keep the same old hardware except on the Mac Pro because that only makes up like 1% of their Mac sales. Apple's newest laptops had the newest CPUs all the way until they transitioned to the M1 series. The year the i9 came out, they put one in their MacBook Pro. I admit they've always put a ridiculously small amount of storage and RAM in the base model of their computers but you that doesn't mean they're using "old" hardware.

And I really don't think that someone that was using XP would have a hard time in Windows 11.

Really? I bet it would take them several minutes to even find the Documents folder. The Windows 11 start menu doesn't even have links to the user folders at all by default. XP's UI was excellent. It was extremely intuitive. Even completely computer illiterate Boomers could get around on it and figure out where stuff was. The UI of Windows has been absolutely TERRIBLE and unintuitive since Windows 8.

So, while you complain about Microsoft "not supporting older hardware" - Apple is a shining example of planned obsolescence and the epitome of not supporting older hardware, above and beyond Microsoft in almost every way.

Yeah Apple is worse. Unfortunately everyone is trying to copy them, including Microsoft. I'm not saying that Apple supports their computers for longer. They won't even accept a computer in for repair if it's 5 years old or older. They only support each OS for 18-24 months so you always have to be on the most recent one in order to get security updates and have compatibility with modern software, and unfortunately Apple only supports running the latest version of MacOS on computers older than 5 years. There are a few exceptions to this most notably the Mac Pro since they release them so infrequently, but Apple does not want to support computers they've already sold. All they care about is selling you new ones.

$200 on Amazon and I have a new machine that meets the reqs. These things aren't even worth the time to discuss.

Not everyone wants to buy some knockoff piece of Chinese garbage that will burn your house down. Even if you buy something from a company that's subject to our laws and it's in their best interest not to sell you something that is dangerous, some people like to actually have a nice computer. The majority of my clients would never dream of spending less than $800 for a computer. From what I've gathered by being a member of this community, my client base is unusual, but the sentiment stands. If you spend a good chunk of change on a computer, you don't want to throw it away and buy a new one all the time. My main laptop is a 7th gen i5 HP EliteBook that I spent $2,500 on. I'm not getting rid of that thing until it can't do what I want it to anymore. And since my needs are pretty basic when it comes to a laptop, that probably wont be for another 5 years. I'm not going to throw it in the garbage just because Microsoft wants to have control over my computer and automatically encrypt my drive and charge me subscriptions for "services" that I don't need.

 

[sapphirescales]

Well, that's quite the edge-case for someone to not change OS's in over 20 years.

LITTLE changes and improvements have been made, but they're not changing the whole UI of the operating system because that's just stupid. Standardization is important when it comes to usability. That's why cars are basically all the same when it comes to where they put the steering wheel, brake pedals, etc. There are minor changes each time they redesign a vehicle, but the way you operate it remains the same (hence the word operating system). Imagine how mad people would be if they parked their car in the garage at the end of the day, and the car manufacturer installed an update in the middle of the night that swapped the functionality of the gas and the break pedal, or if they installed spikes on the steering wheel for "enhanced grip" functionality. NO ONE is asking for this BS!

 

[ThatPlace928]

I still have customers that bring me systems with XP on them........ going from this guy to Windows 11 is a huge jump for anyone who's never used anything but prehistoric era operating systems....... and they drive me nuts trying to remember how to use one this old.......... lol